tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Fri Jan 07 07:20:28 2011
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RE: mu'tlheghvam yIlughmoH
Still another way of asking this question is with a verb {van} "end (an event)":
chay' van bomvam? wej 'e' vISov.
How does this song end? I don't know [that] yet.
HQ 12.2 p.8-9: Generally, one expresses the end of a stretch of time by using a verb rather than a noun. That is, one says "when the month ends" rather than "at the end of the month". The verb for this kind of end is {Dor} [...] When an event over which one has some control ends (one can't cause a month to end), a different verb is used: {van}. This would apply to such things as voyages, battles, plays, operas, stories, and songs. Here, the event (the voyage, the song) doesn't end; the participant in the event or the perpetrator of the event ends it. [...] Note that the voyage and the song cannot end themselves. Someone has to end them. [...]
There is a difference between the end of the performance of a song or opera or play, indicated by making use of the verbs {van} and {ghang} ["end (an event) prematurely"], and the ending, or final portion, of a song or opera or play itself. For an opera, play, story, speech, and so on, the final portion is its {bertlham}. This word usually refers to the last aria or other musical portion in an opera, last speech in a play, last sentence or so of a story or an address [...] For a song--but only for a song--the final portion is its {'o'megh}. Parallel to {bertlham}, {'o'megh} is the final phrase or so of the song, one that brings the song to a definite conclusion. All songs have endings ({'o'meghmey}), some more elaborate or stirring than others.
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
> On Behalf Of lojmIt tI'wI' nuv
> Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 8:17 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: mu'tlheghvam yIlughmoH
>
> A more direct way to say this would perhaps be {bomvam 'o'meH
> vISovbe'.} You seem to go way out of your way to force {'e'} into
> sentences that don't need it. You also really like pronouns.
>
> One of Okrand's goals in designing Klingon was to get rid of the verb
> "to be", and then working with real scripts, he conceded, "Okay, you
> can use pronouns for 'to be'." There are not a lot of examples of him
> using it, and when he does, it tends to be very straightforward, like
> {tlhIngan maH}. English speakers LOVE the various forms of the word "to
> be" and "to go" and "to do" and we pad most of our sentence with them.
>
> Klingon is not encoded English. It is an alien language. Your mind is
> supposed to work differently when you are speaking Klingon than it does
> when you are speaking English. That's the fun part of using it for me.
> I like having to think differently.
>
> Step one is to simplify. Boil the meaning down to its essence, then
> build a Klingon sentence with that essence, dumping "to be" whenever
> you can. There are times when it is just the right thing, like
> {tlhIngan maH}. But much of the time, you don't need "to be". You also
> usually don't need sentences tied to other sentences. You can simplify
> things down to nuggets. It's an attitude as much as it is a process.
>
> In my opinion.
>
> pItlh.
> lojmIt tI'wI' nuv
>
>
>
> On Jan 7, 2011, at 8:22 AM, Felix Malmenbeck wrote:
>
> >> {nuq 'oH bomvam 'o'megh 'e' wej vISov}
> > {nuq 'oH bomvam 'o'megh'e'. wej vISov.} DaghItlh 'e' DaHechpu''a'.
> >
> > {How does this song end? I don't know yet.}
> > bIlugh.
> >
> > jISIv, lughlaH'a' mu'tlheghmey. jISovchu'be'. lughlaH nuvpu'. 'e'
> vISov *canon*mo'. ...'ej lughlaHlaw' Sormey.
> > mu'tlheghmey nuvpu' je vIDelmeH wa' mu' DIvI' Hol vIjatlhtaHvIS. 'a
> SoSwI' Hol vIjatlhtaHvIS pIm ghu'.
> > Sov'a' vay'.
> > ________________________________________
> > From: [email protected] [[email protected]] on
> behalf of Ruben Molina [[email protected]]
> > Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 04:37
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: mu'tlheghvam yIlughmoH
> >
> > juppu' Savan,
> >
> > {nuq 'oH bomvam 'o'megh 'e' wej vISov} qar'a'
> > yIlughmoH qarbe'chugh mu'tlheghvam.
> >
> > ruben
> >
> >
>
>
>