tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu Jan 26 08:52:33 2012
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Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Newbie question about vIneHbogh construction
<div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style="direction:ltr;font-family:Tahoma;color:#000000;font-size:10pt">> tujangpu' 'e' vItlho'.<br>
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I think you want tujangta'mo' Satlho'. Otherwise, you're thanking the replying, not the repliers.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div> jIyaj</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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> wa' mu'tlheghDaq bogh neH latlh wot je vIlo' 'e' QaQbe' qech.<br>
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To the best of y knowledge, QaQ cannot take an object. I recommend something like: "[...] vIlo' 'e' vInID 'ach QaQbe' qechvam." ("I tried to use [...], but this idea is not good.")</div>
</div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>How do I know which verbs take objects which don't ?</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>
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> vIlatlhmeH cha' DuHmey vIlo'laH 'e' vIQub.<br>
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Did you mean vIjatlhmeH, by any chance? latlh isn't a verb.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>HIja'.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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> qatlh pong wot lo'taH SuStel, vIyajbe'. <br>
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Recommend changing "[...] SuStel, vIyajbe'" to "[...] SuStel. jIyajbe'." Otherwise, it looks like you're trying to use a question as an object to make a statement, which does not appear to be allowed (you're allowed to use questions as objects to pose questions,
such as <nuq Datlhutlh DaneH> ("What to you want to drink?"), but what you wanted was probably "I don't understand why SuStel is using the verb <pong>.", which is a statement and therefore not permitted).<br>
</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>vISovpu'be'. vIqaw 'e' vInID.</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style="direction:ltr;font-family:Tahoma;color:#000000;font-size:10pt">
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> nuQ SuQub ?<br>
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I think you want nuq boQub. ("What do you think?")<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>HIja'. nuQ is object of boQub. vIlIjpu'. </div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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> vIQos vIQaghchugh, taghwI' jIH.<br>
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I'd recommend jIQoS jIQaghchugh, as it's unclear what the object of either of those verbs would be.<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>jIyaj</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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...'a bIQoSmeH meq tu'lu'be'. po'wI' mojmeH vay' wa'DIch taghwI' mojnIS 'ej pIghojmoHtaHvIS maghoj je.<br>
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Qapla' HaDwI'!<br>
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<div style="direction:ltr"><font color="#000000" face="Tahoma"><b>From:</b> Wiechu [<a href="mailto:[email protected]"; target="_blank">[email protected]</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 26, 2012 16:48<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:[email protected]"; target="_blank">[email protected]</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Newbie question about vIneHbogh construction<br>
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<div>tujangpu' 'e' vItlho'.</div>
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<div>SuStel QIn vIlaDpu'DI' QaghwIj vIyaj. </div>
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<div>wa' mu'tlheghDaq bogh neH latlh wot je vIlo' 'e' QaQbe' qech.</div>
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<div>vIlatlhmeH cha' DuHmey vIlo'laH 'e' vIQub.</div>
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<div>1) Qov DuH: Dochmey vIleghnISbogh.</div>
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<div>2) loghaD DuH: vIleghmeH Dochmey vIneHbogh.</div>
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<div>qatlh pong wot lo'taH SuStel, vIyajbe'. </div>
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<div>nuQ SuQub ?</div>
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<div>vIQos vIQaghchugh, taghwI' jIH.</div>
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<div><span style="border-collapse:collapse;color:rgb(136,136,136)">--<br>
Wiechu</span><br>
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<div class="gmail_quote">2012/1/25 Steven Boozer <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:[email protected]"; target="_blank">[email protected]</a>></span><br>
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FYI we have two examples of {neHbogh} in canon:<br>
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vay' DaneHbogh yIchargh<br>
Conquer what you desire. TKW<br>
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nuH DaneHbogh yIngu'!<br>
Which weapon do you want?<br>
("Identify the weapon that you want!")<br>
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--<br>
Voragh<br>
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons<br>
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> -----Original Message-----<br>
> From: Philip Newton [mailto:<a href="mailto:[email protected]"; target="_blank">[email protected]</a>]<br>
><br>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 23:45, Wiechu <<a href="mailto:[email protected]"; target="_blank">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<br>
>> I wan to say in Klingon: "Things I want to see" or "Things which I<br>
>> want to see"<br>
>><br>
>> I came with this: Dochmey vIlegh vIneHbogh.<br>
><br>
> Perhaps one way of looking at this is to remember that {Dochmey vIlegh<br>
> vIneH} is (as I understand it) two separate sentences: {Dochmey<br>
> vIlegh} and {vIneH}. With other verbs than {neH}, you need {'e'},<br>
> which makes this clearer - for example, "I see you eat gagh" would be<br>
> {qagh DaSop 'e' vIlegh} ("You eat gagh; I see that"). Translating that<br>
> as "I see you eat gagh" is idiomatically better English but doesn't<br>
> reflect the structure of the Klingon particularly well.<br>
><br>
> So what you're wanting is to access something from the first sentence<br>
> *out of* the second sentence. I'm not sure whether that works -<br>
> {vIneHbogh} would probably either relativise its subject ("The I that<br>
> wants; I who want") or its objects, which I guess is {'e'}: "The fact<br>
> of 'I see things' that I want".<br>
><br>
> Cheers,<br>
> Philip<br>
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