tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue May 02 08:17:29 2006

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Re: Stovokor

Steven Boozer ([email protected])



Shane MiQogh:
> > ghe'torDaq jIHchugh, DaquvHa'lu'ta'.

ghunchu'wI':
>Leaving aside the conceptual strangeness of {-lu'} and {-ta'} on the
>same verb,

We've seen it before:

   So'wI' chu'lu'ta'
   The cloaking device has been engaged. TKD

   Qollu'ta'
   They were beamed aboard a Federation Starship. (subtitle) ST6
   ("They were beamed away.")

   jagh lucharghlu'ta'bogh HuH ghopDu'lIj lungaSjaj
   May the bile of the vanquished fill your hands! PK

as well as {-lu'} and {-pu'} together:

   HeghqangmoHlu'pu'
   It made him willing to die. TKD

   tlhaqwIj chu'Ha'lu'pu'
   My chronometer has stopped. TKD

   nImbuS wejDaq 'ejDo' 'entepray' ngeHlu'pu'
   The starship Enterprise has been dispatched to Nimbus III. (ST5 notes)

   'entepray' Hub patmey luchu'be'lu'pu'
   Enterprise defense systems are down. (ST5 notes)

   Duj So'lu'pu'
   The ship is cloaked
   ("Someone or something has cloaked the ship.") KGT

   nIn Hoch natlhlu'pu'
   All the fuel has been consumed. KGT

   Soj raghmoHlu'pu'
   The food has been decayed.
   Someone has caused the food to decay. KGT

   boqrat chej Qevlu'pu'bogh
   stewed bokrat liver ("bokrat liver that has been stewed") KGT

   Soj vutlu'pu'bogh
   food that someone has prepared KGT

   pIpyuS pach HaHlu'pu'bogh
   pipius claw that has been marinated, marinated pipius claw KGT

   yIntaHvIS qeylIS'e' lIjlaHbe'bogh vay' batlh 'etlhvam chenmoHlu'pu'
   this sword of honor descends from the time of Kahless the Unforgettable. S8

   wa'DIch tlhIngan Dujmey luleghlu'pu'bogh rur qItI'nga' Duj ...
   Similar in configuration to the first Klingon vessels encountered,
   the K'Tinga-class ... S15

   ngongmeH wa' DujDaq nuHmey nISbe'bogh So'wI' jomlu'pu'
   [A cloaking device which didn't disrupt weaponry was installed in one 
experimental ship.] S33

   HovpoH Hut vagh cha' wa' vI' jav Dujvam 'aghlu'pu' 'ach Qaw'lu'pu'
   [This ship was demonstrated on Stardate 9521.6 but it was destroyed.] S33

Shane MiQogh:
> > "If you're in grethor, one has dishonored you."

{quvHa'} is "be dishonored".  To dishonor someone else, use {-moH}:

   DaquvHa'moHlu'ta'
   you have been (intentionally) dishonored
   someone has (intentionally) dishonored you

Our two examples:

   qaStaHvIS wej puq poHmey vav puqloDpu' puqloDpu'chaj je quvHa'moH vav 
quvHa'ghach
   The dishonor of the father dishonors his sons and their sons for three 
generations. TKW

   quvHa'; ghe'tor ngan rur
   dishonored as an inhabitant of Gre'thor KGT

{quvHa'} by itself is a quality referring to the final state of 
dishonor.  It says nothing about how the state was achieved - i.e. did 
someone or something dishonor you {quvHa'moH} or did you dishonor yourself 
{QuvHa''eghmoH}?

>how would your being in Grethor have anything to do with
>someone else's having been dishonored?

   "According to mythology, when a dishonored Klingon dies, his
    or her spirit goes to a place called Gre'thor, there to remain.
    To speak of spirits escaping from Gre'thor is to speak of an
    impossibility." (KGT 117)

   "Fek'lhr is a somewhat ferocious mythological beast that guards
    the entrance to Gre'thor, the place where the spirits of the
    dishonored go." (KGT 130; cf. TKW 197)

    Kortar was captain of the mythical Barge of the Dead; he destroyed
    the gods who created him and as punishment he was condemned to
    ferry the dishonored dead to Gre'thor (VOY "Barge of the Dead).

   "This is the Barge of the Dead. Our dishonored souls are being
    taken to Gre'thor." (VOY "Barge of the Dead")

You know, we've always assumed that your own actions lands you in Gre'thor, 
but I wonder...  Do Klingons believe that you can be dishonored by someone 
else's actions?  E.g. a ship's crew being dishonored en masse by the 
cowardly behavior of their captain fleeing an overwhelming enemy in 
panic?  (Perhaps the dishonor would arise if the crew failed to kill the 
coward and take their ship back into combat to - hopefully - die gloriously.)



--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons






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