tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Mar 22 13:14:44 1999

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RE: wej vIghro'meywIj



quljIb:
> Doq nguv 'ej ngem rur, 'ach chIs qamDu'Daj HughDaj je.
 
pagh:
: <nguv> doesn't work here, and the sentence works without it. I have 
: no idea how s/he (or 'oH in Klingon) can be <Doq> while resembling 
: a forest. Did you mean something other than <ngem>?
 
quljIb:
> Well, she [Raggedy Anne-"Rags" for short] is a brown, taby Maine Coon, 
> of a variety sometimes called the Siberian Forest Cat (not officially
> recognized by international breeders). The only way I could think of 
> to convey "brown taby" was to say "she is {Doq} and resembles (is 
> coloured like) the forest."  

pagh:
: The only colors I can think of when I hear "forest" are the beautiful deep
: green of a natural forest, and the darker green color decorators call
: "forest green" and apply to carpet and the like. Neither of these is even
: remotely <Doq>. 

DloraH:
: Doq, ngem rur - Doq like a forest - brown (when viewed from inside
: the forest; no light, no green)

Or some types of Terran forests, when the {pormey} (leaves) turn all shades
of {Doq} in the Fall.
 
pagh:
: I think you're trying too hard with the color thing. If something is brown,
: it's not green *and* red; it's just brown. Klingon happens to have a single
: word - <Doq> - which covers a wide range of colors, from bright pink to dark
: brown. Everything in that range is <Doq>. Although the color words in
: Enlgish are more specific, there is considerable variety even here - think
: of the difference between "ice blue" and "midnight blue". Do you have
: trouble calling anything in that range just "blue"?
: 	
: I would probably describe your cat as <Doq 'ej Hurgh>. There is a need to
: differentiate your cat from, say, Morris (who is <Doq 'ej wov>), but that's
: about it.

Agreed.  People get too hung up on colors.  As DloraH mentioned, Marc
Okrand discussed brown on startrek.klingon (2/98):

	What we call brown would be described in Klingon by using the verb 
	{Doq} "be red, orange". If the context is clear (such as contrasting 
	a brown thing with a thing that cannot be described as {Doq}, such 
	as something that's {SuD} "blue, green, yellow"), {Doq} alone is good 
	enough. Thus, if there are two drinking cups, one brown and one blue, 
	one might say: {HIvje' Doq vIneH} "I want the Doq cup". Only the brown 
	cup could be described as {Doq}; the blue cup is definitely not {Doq} 
	since it is {SuD}. On the other hand, to be more precise when talking 
	about the color (when, for example, there's a brown cup and a red cup), 
	Klingons would typically use the phrase: {Doq 'ej wovbe'} "be orange/
	red and not be bright". To get even more specific (to be able to refer 
	to different kinds of browns) would involve comparisons. For example: 
	{Doq 'ej Qaj wuS rur} "be orange/red and resemble kradge lips". The 
	lips of the kradge are presumably a particular shade of brown.

For more on colors, see also KGT p. 82:

	Doq 'ej beqpuj rur 
	it is {Doq} and resembles {beqpuj}

If you don't have any bekpuj (an orange-colored mineral) or a kradge (a
type of animal) handy, you can compare your pet to other brownish things.
E.g.:

	Doq vIghro'wIj 'ej yuch (wov/Hurgh) rur.
	My cat is orange/red and resembles (light/dark) chocolate.

	Doq vIghro'wIj 'ej qa'vIn (wov/Hurgh/chIS/qIj) rur.
	My cat is orange/red and resembles (light/dark/white/black) coffee.


-- 
Voragh                       
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons



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