tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Dec 09 15:51:02 1996
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RE: KLBC: latlh vImugh
- From: "HurghwI'" <[email protected]>
- Subject: RE: KLBC: latlh vImugh
- Date: Mon, 09 Dec 1996 17:53:29 -0600
At 04:33 PM 12/8/96 -0800, you wrote:
>December 08, 1996 5:46 PM, jatlh HurghwI':
>
>> wovmoHwI' SuDchoH 'e' DaloStaHvIS bIjaHchugh, jIH DumevmoH yaS.
>> "If you go while waiting for the light to turn green, an officer will stop
>you."
>
>Actually, what you have is more like "If you go while waiting for it to begin
>being blue/green/yellow the brightness-causer, the officer makes you me stop."
>
>Here's the problem with using {SuD} for a traffic light: it covers both yellow
>and green. (Then again, yellow usually means "speed up" anyway . . .)
Ah, I hadn't considered this.
>You've got the wrong pronoun before the {mev} verb. Actually, {mev} is one of
>those verbs which can be used transitively without {-moH} (e.g. {bIjatlh 'e'
>yImev}).
I saw this as transitive in a different way. The officer doesn't cease you!
He _causes_ _you_ to cease your movement. I think that what you are seeing
as transitive is "cease," which is different from the transitive of "stop."
You can cease an action, but not a thing. That's why I chose {-moH} in this
case.
>You don't need to worry about using the {-moH} suffix. (Of course,
>it may not be wrong, either. PK says that you can make your pet stop by
>saying {mev!}. This certainly seems to be intransitive.)
>
>I'm also not happy with the use of {wovmoHwI'} for "light." It literally
>means "thing which causes (something) to be bright." I'd accept (grudgingly)
>{wovwI'} for "light."
I thought of using signal, but I couldn't find it and didn't want to come up
with a similar word. I think you're right, {wovmoHwI'} would be better
applied to a light in a room whose purpose is to provide light.
>One more thing: how can one go while waiting to go? They can't happen
>simultaneously. I'm going to suggest a new structure for this sentence.
Right. I picked this structure because of its complex nature.
>SuDchoHpa' wovwI' bIjaHchugh, Dumev yaS.
>
>Or better yet,
>
>SuDchoHpa' wovwI' bIjaHchugh, Duqop yaS.
I wanted to say he'll give you a ticket, but I didn't want to find something
to mean "ticket." With luck he won't arrest you on the spot!
>> DaqI'chugh, SoHvaD Huch law' vInob.
>> "If you sign it, I will give you lots of money."
>
>Other than the fact you'd have to be signing a *treaty*, this is fine.
Do you suppose a contract can be used with this verb? That's what I was
trying to get at.
>> len wItaghnISbej qeltaHvIS noHwI' ruv nobmeH.
>> "We must certainly have recess while the judge deliberates in order to
>> dispense justice."
>
>Ick. This is a bit complicated, and the best thing to do would be to break it
>into several sentences.
I put it into one sentence to make it more of a challenge.
>Remember, {-meH} clauses must come before the rest of the phrase. Also, I'm
>not sure if one "gives" justice. Just in case you don't . . .
>
>ruv qelnIS noHwI' 'ej wuqnIS. len wItagh.
>The judge needs to consider justice and decide. We will begin recess.
The judge doesn't consider justice. He considers evidence, and then
dispenses justice. I was looking for "enforce."
>This is just one way to say this. There are lots of others.
>
>> yIghoS, jupwI'! SoHvaD HIq vIje', 'ej majawlaH.
>> "Come, my friend! I will buy you a drink, and we can talk."
>
>Almost perfect! {-laH} indicates that one is *able* to do something. Unless
>you've got a very strange set of circumstances, the person is always able to
>chat, so you don't need the {-laH}.
One can always talk, but to me, _chatting_ can only be done comfortably in
the correct situation. BTW, how strict are Klingons in using "can?" I would
think a use such as this would be allowed, because they don't differentiate
between "should," "can," and "may."
>SoHvaD HIq vIje', 'ej majaw.
>I will buy you a drink, and we will talk.
>
>> chab ngevbogh loD qIH "Simon" nap.
>> "Simple Simon met a pieman."
>
>majQa'!
>
>--
>SuStel
>Beginners' Grammarian
>Stardate 96939.1
-HurghwI'
Hovjaj 96941.8