tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Oct 16 21:55:11 1995
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Re: More on HolQeD 4.3
On Sun, 15 Oct 1995, William H. Martin wrote:
> Already, there has been an unanswered request to confirm that
> {lIjaHbe'bogh} is a typo on S9 instead of just a typo in
> HolQeD. Does anyone have S9 so that they can confirm this?
Lawrence said it should have been {lIjlaHbe'bogh}.
> While you are at it, does anybody have S7 so that we can
> confirm that {'op} is supposed to be a word? Does anybody have
> a clue as to what it might mean? I for one don't see any
> unexpressed concepts in the English translation which could be
> ascribed to it. It looks like it must be a noun or an adverbial
> (or a total typographical screwup) by its placement. It is not
> a word I've seen before.
>From the English translation, my best guess is that is means "some" and
it might be a noun.
> And can we confirm that in S9 {yItnISlopwI'} is one word
> instead of the two words it obviously should be?
I was thinking that should be two words too.
> And does
> anyone venture a guess as to why Okrand said {chaH jojDaq}
> instead of {jojchajDaq}? I certainly can't explain it, unless
> Okrand is trying to give us some mysterious new grammatical
> rule, or unless he just blew it.
My best guess that spacial locations are something that can't actually be
possessed. It also seems to follow the usage in Sec. 3.4 where it says
you use N-N constructions to translate prepositional phrases e.g. {nagh
DungDaq} ("above the rock"). Following the rule in Sec. 3.4, it make
more sense to me to say {chaH jojDaq} (in the area between them, "in
between them") rather than {jojchajDaj} (in their area between).
I noticed a different mistake in S9. I think the period at the end of the
second sentence in S9 should be a comma.
> And did anybody notice the obvious word order screw up in S13?
> Hint: The current word order leaves one sentence with no main
> verb.
I was totally baffled by this sentence. I was thinking {QongmeH} should
be {QongwI'}.
> And while someone pointed out that Lawrence was apparently
> incorrect in attributing the first use of {je} on more than two
> nouns to the copyright notice, did anybody notice that S14 has
> a relatively undisputable example of just this useage?
There are two {je}'s in the copyright notice. The first {je} in the
sentence is clearly joining three things.
I think that sentence in S14 is really only 2 noun constructions.
(See my other post on this subject).
> And how about the apparent use of an ordinal number as an
> adverbial in S15? Either that or Okrand screwed up his word
> order again...
Nouns expressing time seem to function like adverbials. When you put
nouns like {DaHjaj} & {wa'leS} at the beginning of the sentence, they
express when the action described by the sentence takes place. E.g.
{DaHjaj nom Soppu'.}
I think {tera' vatlh DISpoH cha'maH loS} (the Terran hundred year
time period No. 24, "(in) the 24th century") is just another example of this.
I do think the first sentence in S15 is really two and there needs to be
a period after {Duj}.
> And can someone confirm whether on the original card
"century" > is expressed as {vatlh DIS poH} or {vatlh DISpoH} or both, as
> it is shown in HolQeD?
Good question.
> Come on, guys. Everyone has been bragging about this new,
> expanded field of expert Klingonists. Do we sleep? Here is food
> for warriors! Attack! Today is a good day to dissect canon!
I'm puzzled by the second sentence in S13, it seems to be lacking a main
verb.
Another inconsistency is the title of S15 says {qItI'nga} and the text says
{qItI'nga'}.
And, as ghor pointed out, {betleH} is spelled as {batleH}.
I was pleased to see a lot of new constructions. We now know how to say
"generation", "Imperial Klingon Vessel", "disruptor pisol", "disruptor
rifle", "(rifle) stock", "U.S.S. Enterprise", "Kahless the Unforgettable",
"K'Vort", and "T'Ong". And if we can figure out the correct spelling, we
have words for "K'Tinga" and "century".
We also have expanded meanings of existing words:
wIch = legend, naQ = (rifle) stock, patlh = level, SaH = to express
devotion, potlh = values, and HochHom = most
I was glad to see canon endorsement of {-'e'} on the head noun of a
relative clause and the use of {je} when there is more than three nouns.
And it's now confirmed that Klingon ranks come after the person's
name as indicated in ST 5. I guess Qel, trI'qal & Qanqor now need to go
by Qel 'aj, trI'qal HoD & Qanqor HoD.
> charghwI'
yoDtargh