tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sun Nov 20 20:29:28 1994

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Re: SatlhobneS

Good questions.

According to Riku Anttila:
> 
> nuqneH. I have a variety of questions and this must be the right place
> for them. At least #1 and #2 are for KLBC.
> 
> 1. Probably because English is not my native language, I'm having
>    difficulties in understanding the meaning of {net}. Could you
>    please define it in other words and perhaps give a few examples
>    where I could or should use it.

Given the way the question is stated, I presume you understand
how to use the pronoun {'e'}. If you do not understand {'e'},
please correct me so I can explain more.

{net} is a variation on the pronoun {'e'}. If you understand
the suffix {-lu'}, then essentially, {net} is the same thing as
{'e' [verb]lu'}. Example:

qama'pu' wIHoH 'e' Sovlu' = qama'pu' wIHoH net Sov.

Both of these examples tell you that an unspecified, generic
entity knows that we kill prisoners. It is the global, generic
person. "One knows that we kill prisoners." This can also be
translated as the passive, "It is known that we kill
prisoners." It basically means, "Everyone knows that we kill
prisoners."

Given that we have {net} to serve this function, it is apparent
that the above example using {'e'} is not proper Klingon. In
other words, if {net} did not exist, we would use the first
sentence above {qama'pu' wIHoH 'e' Sovlu'.} Meanwhile, we DO
have {net} and it ALWAYS replaces {'e' [verb]lu'}. Think of it
as an irregular form of the pronoun {'e'} used in this one
setting.

Does this help?

> 2. I have a problem with the pronouns used as verbs. One says
>    {tlhIngan SoH.}, but one also says {SoH 'Iv?} even though
>    'Iv "fits the into the sentence in the position that would
>    be occupied by the answer." Could you explain this to me?

Okrand has been inconsistent here. You are not the first person
to have a problem with this. Most Klingonists would agree that
the question would be equally well stated as {'Iv SoH?}. It is
apparently irregular and the kind of thing that Klingons
(especially those with the last name Okrand) don't always say
the same way every time. Realize that no matter which way you
say it, any Klingon will understand what you are asking.

In general, the pronoun will come second in a sentence. If you
ask me either {SoH 'Iv} or {'Iv SoH}, my answer will always be
{charghwI' jIH} and never {jIH charghwI'}.

> 3. There are some words in TKD I don't understand. What are
>    quadrotriticale and topaline? The gaps are most likely in my
>    Trek-, general- or DIvI' Hol knowledge. Is bregit lung something
>    edible? What's a pipius, an animal with edible claws?

Okrand intentionally put in some words that are meaningful only
to those who are familiar with words they made up in the Star
Trek series. Quadrotriticale is a type of grain immortalized in
the line, "Who put the tribbles in the quadrotriticale?"

I do not know what topaline is. I'm sure someone else on this
list does, however, and will not rest until they tell us. {{:)>

The same is true of bregit lung.

As for pipius, we do know that it is an animal with edible
claws, and that's about it.

> 4. How would I ask "_How_many_times_ did you hit him?" etc.?

I find Nick's suggestion of {'arlogh DaqIp} intriguing. It is
completely sensible, given that {nuq} is the question word
replaced by a noun, and so it is treated like a noun, and
{chay'} is a question word replaced by an adverbial, and so it
is treated as an adverbial, so it is logical that {'ar}, which
is the question word replaced by a number, should be treated
like a number. Question words and numbers are both chuvmey,
after all.

I actually like that BETTER than any of his other suggestions.
The {qaStaHvIS} constructions seem not only cumbersome by
comparison, but also they miss the point. They place emphasis
on the duration rather than the numeric count of instances.

> QI'DaS tuQbej SoSlI'
> :ghor:.

'ej bIHDaq Dunqu' narghtaHghachDaj. ghaHvaD jIHem.

charghwI'

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