tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Jul 19 06:04:43 1994
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Re: Transliteration,etc. Was Re: *boHem*ngan bomnong
- From: HoD trI'Qal <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: Transliteration,etc. Was Re: *boHem*ngan bomnong
- Date: Tue, 19 Jul 1994 17:10:19 -0400 (EDT)
- In-Reply-To: <[email protected]> from "David E G Sturm" at Jul 12, 94 02:05:49 am
> I strongly agree with the khodr on this issue. And add that going the
> other way with a thlingonkhol phrase is equally a cardinal and mortal sin!
> As these previous sentences should clue you in to. I would suggest
> though, that it does teach you something about Klingon *phonology*,
> particularly that just as with Russian, just because it is written with a
> D symbol or a S, does not mean it has the same method of production.
> That's an even better reason for not writing *vIl'a' DelvIy'a'...
I agree. Why does the name <Kitlh> come to mind...? (For those of you
who don't know him, Kitlh was a person who didn't like Okrand's notation
system, and used his own instead: kh for Q, k for q, h for H, and perhaps a
few others I don't remember anymore. The net result was that his Hol was
completely unreadable... to anyone but *him*.)
> Unfortunately, Marc Okrand includes some disgusting examples of straight
> transliteration.... Such as
> >tlhaq< n chronometer (yeah, well it's just "clock")
> >QonoS< n journal, log (yeah, well looks like a "chronos" to me)
Oh? I don't see what the problem is with these. I suppose you include
<bIr> in there as well? To me, these are just more examples of his sense
of humor. After all, I didn't get <tlhaq> until I tried to pronounce it...
> and the more forgivable place names such as
> >vulqan< place Vulcan
> >romuluS< place Ch'Rihan (BTW, the Klingons would use the Fed name for a
> race they knew before the UFP!?!?!? Right.)
> >telun< place Tellun (why not >tellun<? Then we can say ours is the
> transliteration of Klingon! Then again, maybe it is.)
> >SermanyuQ< place Sherman's planet (If I didn't know that Dave Gerrold named
> the place for a girl, Holly Sherman, I
> would again suggest we transliterated the
> original Klingon name...)
>
> So if I wanted the Tholian Empire, following Okrand's example, I think it
> would be okay to create:
> >*tlholuS< Tholus
> >*tlholuSngan wo'< Tholian Empire. or even
> >*(Sol, merQIy, vIynuS, tera', martuS, jupter, SeturnuS, yurnuS,
> neptun, pIlu 'to', persevone')....<
Possibly. Remember that "Klingon" isn't an English word, either.
However, it got used so much (presumably) by the Federation members who
dealt with them that the terran version stuck. Why can't the same be
true for Hol?
And besides, it comes down to that one last little thing: We can't add
anything to the language. Even if transliterating something would make
perfectly good sense, we can't do it... unless we flag it. Only
Paramount/Okrand can create new words.
Not to mention the sheer difficulty in understanding. when I see
transliterations, I automatically attempt to translate them, unless they
are flagged. this causes more confusion than it is worth. Invariably,
even if *I* get it, *someone* is gong to send a post saying 'I don't
understand this word?!?!?!?' I would rather not have such stuff flooding
my mailbox. (Yeah, I know; I'm one to talk, considering the stuff I have
been sending lately... {{:/ )
> BTW, >*SIp< has appeared in the WALL STREET JOURNAL! Maybe I should drop
> the asterisk now....
Personally, I would be VERY upset if you did. I would have a hard time
translating it. No, I am *not* going to memorize that it is just one of
those transliteration-things; memorizing the regular vocab is hard enough
as it is! {{;)
--HoD trI'Qal
tlhwD lIy So'