tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Jul 11 17:28:22 1994

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Re: Transliteration,etc. Was Re: *boHem*ngan bomnong



When people are talking foreign languages, sometimes they will say word - 
word - word - "Los Angeles" - word - word - word, etc...it is perfectly 
acceptable to communicate in that fashion.   Not all languages have the 
word "scooter"   {{:-)


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On Tue, 12 Jul 1994, David E G Sturm wrote:

> 
> >> HoD voghyoy wrote:
> >HoD Qanqor wrote:
> >>It is absolutely important to emphasize that anytime you use a word that 
> >>is not in direct evidence in the corpus to flag it.
> >>And of course, the traditional way is simple.  Just remember to put an 
> >>asterisk in front of the word which is not in evidence, e.g.
> >> >*SIp<   n sheep   <transliteration of English to describe Terran animal
> 
> > I should like to take this opportunity to remind people that the policy of
> > this list is to frown upon transliteration.  It makes it look all clever
> > and all but it is hard to read and understand, and sometimes you have to
> > just admit that Klingon just doesn't have a word for a thing and use the
> > English.  Especially proper nouns, like "Philadelphia".  Some amount
> > of transliteration shows up here because we get posts of things from
> > the translation projects, which, understandably, have some different
> > guidelines.  But as far as basic list conversation, it is better to
> > not obfuscate.  *maS'e'chu'Setlh is just inherantly harder to grok
> > than just saying "Massachusetts", and going through the trouble to
> > figure it out doesn't teach you anything about Klingon anyway.
> 
> I strongly agree with the khodr on this issue.  And add that going the 
> other way with a thlingonkhol phrase is equally a cardinal and mortal sin!
> As these previous sentences should clue you in to.  I would suggest 
> though, that it does teach you something about Klingon *phonology*, 
> particularly that just as with Russian, just because it is written with a 
> D symbol or a S, does not mean it has the same method of production.
> That's an even better reason for not writing *vIl'a' DelvIy'a'...
> 
> Unfortunately, Marc Okrand includes some disgusting examples of straight 
> transliteration....  Such as 
> >tlhaq<  n chronometer (yeah, well it's just "clock")
> >QonoS<  n journal, log (yeah, well looks like a "chronos" to me)
> and the more forgivable place names such as 
> >vulqan< place Vulcan
> >romuluS< place Ch'Rihan (BTW, the Klingons would use the Fed name for a
>                           race they knew before the UFP!?!?!? Right.)
> >telun< place Tellun  (why not >tellun<?  Then we can say ours is the 
>                        transliteration of Klingon!  Then again, maybe it is.)
> >SermanyuQ< place Sherman's planet (If I didn't know that Dave Gerrold named
>                                     the place for a girl, Holly Sherman, I
>                                     would again suggest we transliterated the
>                                     original Klingon name...)
> 
> So if I wanted the Tholian Empire, following Okrand's example, I think it 
> would be okay to create:
> >*tlholuS< Tholus
> >*tlholuSngan wo'< Tholian Empire.    or even
> >*(Sol, merQIy, vIynuS, tera', martuS, jupter, SeturnuS, yurnuS, 
> neptun, pIlu 'to', persevone')....<
> But I think the * freedom extends freely *only* on space places, not 
> modern Earth places.... (Fortunately Biblical places don't require much 
> change when transliterating--hmmmm, maybe Klingon is the language of one 
> of the lost tribes....  Maybe the Age of Ascension is when Klingon males 
> are circumcised!  Ouch, what a bar mitzvah oldstyle!!!!!!!!!!!  I bet 
> they don't have a redundant backup for that... or then again, maybe that 
> is why Troi is smiling a lot more.....)
> 
> BTW, >*SIp< has appeared in the WALL STREET JOURNAL!  Maybe I should drop 
> the asterisk now....
> 
> [email protected]                        overheard- "Pardon me, but if I must
> David E G Sturm, Laboratory Manager (eff 8/94)     operate in a vacuum, can
> Wake Forest University Department of Physics       I at least have a little
> POB 7261 Reynolda Station, Winston-Salem NC 27109  ether to calm my nerves?"
> 
> 



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