tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Dec 06 08:30:35 1994
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Re: Hoch vISovnIS
Please, folks, let the Grammarians and Beginner's Grammarians have a crack
at these things first, OK?
>Date: Tue, 6 Dec 1994 09:17:45 -0500
>Originator: [email protected]
>From: "William H. Martin" <[email protected]>
>According to Joel Anderson:
>>
>> Hoch vISovnIS 'e' wa'DIch DuSaQDaq jIghojta'
>"I have accomplished the goal of learning at first school that
>I must know everything." [Note that {wa'DIch} should FOLLOW
>{DuSaQ} because it is an ordinal number.]
>> "Everything I need to know I learned in Kindergarten"?
>Not quite. A better way to cast this meaningfully in English
>would be "In kindergarden, I learned everything WHICH I need to
>know." That gives you a clue as to how to say it in Klingon:
>DuSaQ wa'DIchDaq Hoch vISovnISbogh vIghojta'.
>The one controversial thing I've done here is place {-Daq}
>after the ordinal number instead of the noun. I'm guessing that
>this is the case, since the ordinal number is being used
>adjectivally, and adjectival VERBS would receive the Type 5
>noun suffix instead of the preceeding noun. Since the ordinal
>number functions like an adjectival verb and is located like an
>adjectival verb, it seems logical that the suffix should move
>to it in a similar way. It makes the pair of words more clearly
>function as a grammatical unit. If others have a problem with
>this, I'm open to suggestions.
Oh, I'd certainly agree with your interpretation on where to put the -Daq;
treating ordinals like adjectival verbs sounds like the best plan.
>I've done this before and nobody commented on it.
>Note also that other castings might be acceptable as well, like:
>ngoD vISovnISchugh vaj DuSaQ wa'DIchDaq vIghojnISba'ta'.
>"If I must know a fact, then obviously, I must have
>accomplished learning it in kindergarden."
Nice recasting, typical of the charghwI' method of capturing the meaning
more clearly than the original. One thing I haven't seen yet which might
go nicer than the -Daq is a construction involving "-taHvIS" to indicate
when you were studying this stuff... Maybe jIHaDtaHvIS, or something.
>charghwI'
>--
~mark