tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Jun 17 17:37:05 2014
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Re: [Tlhingan-hol] 'arDaq
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<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif">"It's logical that it would be a word, since {'arlogh} is a word, and since {'ar} is the question word replaced by a number, and {-logh} is a number suffix, that since {-DIch} is a number suffix, you could put it on {'ar}, too, but that's an assumption that has not been backed up by either use in canon or grammatical discussion or description by Marc Okrand."<BR><BR>Maybe it's not a word because of the irregularity you pointed out.</DIV></DIV>
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<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From: </SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif"><A href="mailto:[email protected]";>[email protected]</A></SPAN><BR><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent: </SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif">6/17/2014 5:01 PM</SPAN><BR><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To: </SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif"><A href="mailto:[email protected]";>tlhIngan Hol mailing list</A></SPAN><BR><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif; FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject: </SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; FONT-FAMILY: Calibri,sans-serif">Re: [Tlhingan-hol] 'arDaq</SPAN><BR><BR></DIV>
<DIV>The point that has been made that you seem to have missed is that *{'arDIch} is apparently not a word.</DIV>
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<DIV>It's logical that it would be a word, since {'arlogh} is a word, and since {'ar} is the question word replaced by a number, and {-logh} is a number suffix, that since {-DIch} is a number suffix, you could put it on {'ar}, too, but that's an assumption that has not been backed up by either use in canon or grammatical discussion or description by Marc Okrand.</DIV>
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<DIV>So, the word *{'arDIch} is not a word, and discussing it further is futile.</DIV>
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<DIV>The only use of {-DIch} that is valid is applying it to a number to be functionally equivalent of what happens in English when you add "th" to "5" to make "5th".</DIV><BR>
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<DIV>On Jun 17, 2014, at 4:16 PM, Brad Wilson <<A href="mailto:[email protected]";>[email protected]</A>> wrote:</DIV><BR class=Apple-interchange-newline>
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<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><FONT size=2><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: arial, helvetica"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: arial">>>></SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: arial, helvetica"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: arial">If I ask, "Which door do you choose?", it's still simple {lojmIt 'arDIch DawIv?} </SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="arial, helvetica">You answer "I choose the third door." {lojmIt wejDIch vIwIv.}</FONT></TT></PRE>
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<DIV id=AOLMsgPart_0_f091bd8c-ff00-4d85-9e69-48eaeeb786b0 style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; MARGIN: 0px; BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(255,255,255)"><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><<< </SPAN></TT></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">If {'arDIch} really means "which" in the sense of "one of a choice of options", then </FONT></TT><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">I could answer with {lojmItvatlh vIwIv} (pointing to my selection) or {lojmIt SuD vIwIv} and not use {-DIch} at all.</SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">The question I was asking earlier:</SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">>>></SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Is there are requirement that if the question uses {'arDIch} that the answer </SPAN><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">must use {number-DIch}?</SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT>It would seem that {-DIch} is a "sequential" marker that identifies its headword
either by appearance to the speaker, or importance, or by some other criterion.</TT></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"><<<</FONT></TT></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">All uses of {-DIch} that I'm aware of seem to be that of "ordinalizing" a number, i.e. ordering either in space or time.</FONT></TT></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">In English, the word "which" can have an ordinal sense to it:</FONT></TT></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">... </FONT></TT><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">"the position in a sequence of doors in front of me" or "the appearance of doors over time (say, walking down a hall)".</SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">But "which" can also mean "a choice from a selection without regard to order".</SPAN></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">My question is, without further clarification from MO, can we say that {'arDIch} also has this broader meaning of "one of a choice, order notwithstanding"?</FONT></TT></PRE><PRE style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><TT><FONT face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">gheyIl</FONT></TT></PRE></DIV><!-- end of AOLMsgPart_0_f091bd8c-ff00-4d85-9e69-48eaeeb786b0 --></DIV></FONT></DIV></FONT>_______________________________________________<BR>Tlhingan-hol mailing list<BR><A href="mailto:[email protected]";>[email protected]</A><BR>http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></BODY></HTML>_______________________________________________
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