tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Apr 17 05:50:21 2012
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
Re: [Tlhingan-hol] The Lord's Prayer
- From: Philip Newton <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] The Lord's Prayer
- Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2012 14:49:50 +0200
- Dkim-signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=qtPvxrZzr8cFlio40e/rFBLS6QjU09NJ4yEXtwvMsw0=; b=bQF7651mjFe3++mt4iE9yyU4a8F/4cyHDlu1vOW7H1OgUMiOld4eCmadLO3boUPWWm si6pM1ywE+oKs6YYJK/77E32qQAMf6mHemKSjtGBwGPhEE5SYbFFCgTkgruAE3kmpCkN it0OXO814wr5Zyo/P9gQdQqciViWpH+eZf7eOLWjZSn/GJ2VNt7dgZ4c1bGpSxic2sih 2KN3tEZitpP8twIVHv484pQwUK4BzQWAUoX8S+BEk5WlD9B/+RdJKFuZ9Y1xBV7K3Pqi mZD1DtSFuDbUIB918mmaeEWLcNuTbj2MnLi0B1f3b/V3w2pbbDGyOgbVgfImJJK5nmMN ZcGw==
- In-reply-to: <CAMZYS2XMoPuYvovExb38iAmDiaDxc+2wF3g1z4HqL7nGG4nwfA@mail.gmail.com>
- List-archive: <http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/pipermail/tlhingan-hol/>
- List-id: <tlhingan-hol.stodi.digitalkingdom.org>
- List-subscribe: <http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol>, <mailto:[email protected]?subject=subscribe>
- References: <CAMZYS2XVjEoF7j9bxx-Xqf2EdYytmueMAogNtWXkFuhFJeKFVA@mail.gmail.com> <ACF6622D959A8842A81E4471BA56A7E093DE@xm-mbx-04-prod.ad.uchicago.edu> <[email protected]> <CAMZYS2UiaOrZyiLkrSePRFW_6XqRHrmAQe+hTRNjHAffocJx4g@mail.gmail.com> <CA+cwSm_SkvBzbBDBS79V9Xb_fy2-ey_wD4K9NvZZoCdBZ+N=Pw@mail.gmail.com> <ACF6622D959A8842A81E4471BA56A7E0B90C@xm-mbx-04-prod.ad.uchicago.edu> <CA+cwSm9=FCr2mhF3LphQLFt+E6Pj7fUTmpU+acn+x70k87EPug@mail.gmail.com> <[email protected]> <CAMZYS2XMoPuYvovExb38iAmDiaDxc+2wF3g1z4HqL7nGG4nwfA@mail.gmail.com>
On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 10:23, Michael Roney, Jr. PKT <[email protected]> wrote:
> 9 Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
> Suto'vo'qorDaq SoHtaH vavmaj; ponglIj quvmoH.
>
> **So am I correct in saying that God's name can't speak?
> There seems to be some debate on this topic...
Misunderstanding - I was referring to your use of {vavmaj} rather than
your use of {ponglIj}.
The father can speak, so I think he should be {vavma'}.
>>Qov:
>>"Hallowed be thy name" is a wish that something happen, See TKD 4.2.9 appendix.
>
> **Is it? I didn't gloss that from the text.
> **I took it as "Your name is hallowed"
That would be "Hallowed is thy name". I agree with Qov that the use of
the subjunctive "be" marks it as a wish.
The Greek has an imperative here (which acts as a jussive in the third
person, I think -- the "may" idea which corresponds pretty much to
{-jaj}, as I understand it).
> 10 Thy kingdom come.
> wo'Daj cher
>
> **Yes, that should be {wo'lIj} unless the kingdom can speak...
...in which case it would be {wo'lI'}, but not in any event {wo'Daj}.
Also {cherlu'jaj}, I think: again with the subjunctive "come" (normal
indicative would be "Thy kingdom comes" with final -s) pointing
towards {-jaj} for me. And again, the Greek has an imperative/jussive
here.
> 11 Give us this day our daily bread.
>
> DaHjajvam tIr ngoghmaj junobneS.
Not {ghonobneS}?
It feels like an imperative, and the Greek is definitely one.
Cheers,
Philip
--
Philip Newton <[email protected]>
_______________________________________________
Tlhingan-hol mailing list
[email protected]
http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol