tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sat Jan 24 22:24:09 1998
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
Re: KLBC pong (v)
- From: Qov <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: KLBC pong (v)
- Date: Sat, 24 Jan 1998 22:23:17 -0800
At 19:42 98-01-22 -0800, qe'San wrote:
}
}qe'San 'oH pongwIj'e'
}
}or as I prefer:
}
}qe'San chopongjaj (addressed to Qov) or qe'San tupongjaj
}(addressed to all readers of the list).
I follow your logic, and I'm trying to decide if "give me chocolate" and
"call me Ishmael" have the same grammar. I'll say that they do, barring
contradiction from one of the real linguists on this group. (I'm not a real
linguist, I just play one on the internet). But even assuming that what you
have is a reasonable use of the prefix-to-indicate-indirect-object trick,
the sentiment "May it come to pass that you call me qe'San!" isn't high on
my list of appropriate introductions. See below where you wrote {*chay'
qapongjaj} for more on this.
}Greetings! I've been putting this off for some time now, not wanting
}to make a complete fool of myself but as the saying goes:
}bIlujlaHbe'chugh bIQaplaHbe'
teHbej.
}Now that I've committed myself, have I made the correct use of cho- &
} tu- ?
}What I mean is would each reader be singular, although plural in
}total. Each person would obviously read the message as if directed at
}him/herself or would tu- be required to indicate that they are not the
}only reader. I seem to be going round in circle there so I'll go on to
}my next point.
In languages that distinguish between singular and plural you, sometimes
writing directed to a mass audience (e.g. advertising) uses the singular to
simulate intimacy. But had you not used tu- I would have pointed it out as
a problem.
}I noticed in the FAQ that there was a problem with the use of the verb
} pong as in how it should be used. My thoughts there are that
}instead of using it with the question what? shouldn't it be used with
}the question how? just like in the example given by MO on page 70 TKD
}relating to: What are your orders? - chay' jura'
}(clipped) - (literally)How do you order us?
{chay' jura'} is not clipped.
}
}Applying this to pong I ended up with:
}
}chay' ponglu' - How someone call you? - How are you called (by
}someone)?
maj.
}chay' qapong - How I call you ?
I see no problem. "How shall I call you?" ould be a more grammatical
translation.
}or if your lucky:
}
}chay' qapongjaj - How may I call you?
No.
I'm glad you included this one because it cleared up what you were trying to
do with the {-jaj} in your first sentences. The suffix {-jaj} denotes "may"
only in the sense of expressing a wish for the future. "May the fleas of a
thousand camels infest your armpits" NOT "I may go to China" or "you may
borrow the car."
chay' qapong DaneH? - How do you want me to call you?
qapong chay' 'e' Dachaw' - How will you permit me to call you?
}Sorry for going on a bit there.
qay'be'.
Qov [email protected]
Beginners' Grammarian