tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Jul 19 13:07:27 2005
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Re: bIQ'a' wIghoSchugh...
Voragh:
> > Agreed, but don't forget to use {-taH} for locations:
> >
> > wej jaj qaStaHvIS bIQDaq 'oHtaH porgh'e'
> > the body has been in the water for three days
> >
> > DaHjaj po bIQDaq 'oHchoHtaH porgh'e'
> > the body appeared/turned up in the water this morning
lay'tel SIvten wrote:
>Why is {-taH} always added on when talking about locations?
This has long been recognized as one of those "undocumented features" of
the language: The "rule" can be derived from Okrand's example sentences,
even though he never states it outright. The first example is in the
section on the locative suffix {-Daq} (TKD p.27):
pa'Daq jIHtaH
I'm in the room. [TKD 27]
with additional examples later in TKD:
pa'wIjDaq jIHtaH
I am in my quarters. [TKD 68]
pa'DajDaq ghaHtaH la''e'
The commander is in his quarters. [TKD 68]
jIHtaHbogh naDev vISovbe'
I'm lost. [TKD List of Useful Expressions]
Even more examples showed up later:
naDev bIHtaH
Here they are. [PK]
loS... qIb HeHDaq, 'u' SepmeyDaq Sovbe'lu'bogh lenglu'meH
He ghoSlu'bogh retlhDaq 'oHtaH
It waits... on the edge of the galaxy, beside a passage to
unknown regions of the universe. [DS99]
qIrq! DujHomDaq ghaHtaH.
Kirk. He's on the shuttlecraft! [ST5]
bIghHa'Daq ghaHtaH qama''e'
The prisoner is in the prison. [KGT]
bIQ'a'Daq 'oHtaH 'etlh'e'
The sword is in the ocean. [KGT]
S27 is a nice example of both:
pa' 'oHtaH vaS'a''e'. tlhIngan qum waw' 'oH.
This is where the Klingon Great Hall is located, the center
of the Klingon government. [S27]
Note the contrast: {pa' 'oHtaH vaS'a''e'} "the Great Hall is located
there" vs. {tlhIngan qum waw' 'oH} "it is the government's base".
Using {taH} seems to imply "to be [located] continuously at/on/in
somewhere". (As always, {-Daq} is not added to {naDev} "here", {pa'}
"there" and {Dat} "everywhere".) In both cases, the subject noun is marked
with {-'e'}.
>And did you make up these examples? They're given as if they were quotations.
No, they're given as my own examples with a bit of context, indented to
make them easier to read. Had I been quoting Okrand, I would have given
the source (TKD, PK, KGT, etc.)
>Is {wej jaj} in the first of these sentences the subject of {qaStaHvIS}?
>I.e., {qaStaHvIS wej jaj...}
Drat! For some reason, I -always- get this wrong for some reason. I must
be thinking of {wej jaj} as a time stamp, which precedes the rest of the
sentence.
>And for the second one, I would use the more literal {nargh} for "appear",
>instead of {'oHchoH(taH)}.
I was trying to render {'oHchoHtaH} as "show up, turn up, be somewhere
unexpected". I must admit, though, to have quite forgotten {nargh}:
HeghDI' SuvwI' nargh SuvwI' qa'.
When a warrior dies, his spirit escapes. [TKW 145]
The verb {nargh} ... means "escape", but the same word, or a
phonetically identical one, means "appear". Thus, perhaps
the Klingons are saying that when a warrior dies, his spirit
appears, whereas prior to death it was hidden or disguised by
the body. Another interpretation is that the prisoner was held
prisoner by the body. Worf told Jeremy, whose mother had been
killed, "In my tradition, we do not grieve the loss of the
body. We celebrate the releasing of the spirt." [TKW 145]
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons