tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sat Feb 20 14:50:59 1999
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
Placement of aspect suffixes
ja' peHruS:
>Okay. Here is a challenge. Make a course on where you have learned to place
>aspect in complex sentences and send it to me.
I'm not sure that would help either of us much. What I tend to see as
clear and useful explanations often fail to reach you at all, much less
convince you of what I think is correct.
My use of aspect suffixes is based on what I want the sentences to mean.
It's just like my use of any other suffix, or prefix, or word, or idiom,
or even punctuation.
>I have consistently, as long
>as we have been part of KLI, been using aspect markers in the main clauses.
Then you appear to have fixated on a rule of thumb at the expense of the
meaning behind your sentences. Let's take a look at the sentences that
troubled me this time:
>qepDaq tev gheSmeH gor'al, *raffle tickets* DIngevpu'
>*Praying Hands Ranch*vaD Hoch Huchvetlh wInobpu'
The context here was as the last part of a narrative of things that took
place in the past, so I'll translate it using English past tense. As
literally as I can, I read this as:
"In order for {gor'al} to take on the duties of a/the prize at a/the
meeting, we had sold raffle tickets. We had given each of those monies
for the benefit of Praying Hands Ranch."
I think the idea you wanted was more like this:
"In order for {gor'al} to have taken on the duties of a/the prize at
a/the meeting, we sold raffle tickets. We gave all the money for the
benefit of Praying Hands Ranch."
Can you see why I've put the perfective on the clause I did here?
If the context had been different, the way you said it might have been
appropriate. If you were talking about the present situation instead
of past actions, I would have understood it as follows:
"In order for {gor'al} to take on the duties of a/the prize at a/the
meeting, we have sold raffle tickets. We have given each of those
monies for the benefit of Praying Hands Ranch."
It's still somewhat odd, since there's no real grammatical clue that the
"have given" is intended to be after the "have sold" event. In a context
that suggests present tense translation, I would have expected perfective
only on the "have sold" idea.
Try to keep in mind the already revealed context of actions as you decide
whether or not an aspect suffix is appropriate on any verb. Knowing what
you mean when you write it doesn't always help other people know what you
mean when they *read* it.
-- ghunchu'wI'