tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Wed Oct 22 22:36:41 1997
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Re: KLBC naDev jIchu'
- From: Qov <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: KLBC naDev jIchu'
- Date: Wed, 22 Oct 1997 22:36:40 -0700
At 11:45 97-10-20 -0700, Doneq wrote:
ghItlh Qov
>> > *Netherlands* vIDab.
>> > I live in The Netherlands.
>> nov Hol law' HaD Netherlands nganpu', qar'a'?
> qarbej.
> *Dutch* Hol *English* Hol je HaDnIS Hoch.
> *French* Hol *German* Hol *Latin* Hol *Greek* tIQ Hol je HaDlu' net
> DuH
There's a problem here. I'll explain {DuH}, {'e'} and {net} to make
the problem clear.
{DuH} means "be possible." The thing that is possible is the subject
and the definition suggests nothing that could be the object.
{DuH nap} "the plan is possible"
{'e'} is an object pronoun that stands in for the previous sentence.
{'e'} must act as the object of the verb in the new sentence. There
is no other function for the pronoun {'e'} and there is no general
way we know of representing a sentence as the subject of another
verb.
{net} serves exactly the same purpose as {'e'} except that the
the verb for which {net} is the object always has an indefinite
subject. {net is the exact equivalent of {'e' <verb>lu'}.
So when you say {<something> *net DuH} you say "one possibles
<something>" A sentence like "it is possible that <whatever>" isn't
really the same as "I see that <whatever>." The latter can be
translated with sentence as object but the former demands a
non-existant sentence as subject. DuHbe' ghu'vetlh.
> latlh DuSaQmeyDaq *Spanish* Hol HaDlu' net DuH je.
You could say {... net DuHmoH} "It is made possible to ..."
{... net chaw'} "one is permitted to ..."
{Holmey HaDlaH vay'} "Someone can study the languages"
> 'ach Do'Ha' DuSaQmeyDaq tlhIngan Hol HaDlu' net DuHbe'.
>
> (Is {-lu' net DuH} a good alternative for {-luH} or {-la'} as in
> KGT?)
I'm glad you recognized that you shouldn't use {-luH} and {-la'}, and
I hope you now understand why {-lu' net DuH} isn't working either.
> > Do'Ha' DuSaQDaq (juHDaq DuSaQvaD je) latlh vay' vIHaDnISlI' je
> > }:-( Unfortunately I have to study other things at school (and at
> > home for school) too.
> The word {vay'} is "something." Better to use {Doch} for a more
> specific "thing." {latlh Doch} {latlh Dochmey}
> When I see the word "thing", I usually think of "real" things that one
> can touch. But {Doch} is apparently also used for more abstract
> "things", qar'a'?
In English, the language MO defined Klingon in, a "thing" can be an event, a
feeling, an object, pretty much any inanimate third person. MO doesn't put
a qualification on {Doch} for tangibles, so I accept it for intangibles. My
quibble with {vay'} vs {Doch} is that {vay'} means
someone/something/anyone/anything but the things you have to do for school
are specific things. After all, if you could do just anything to fulfil
your school requirements, you'd do tlhIngan Hol, qar'a'? :)
> Some more practise sentenses:
>
> Hoch tlhIngan Hol paqmey vIlaDta'.
> I've read all books on the Klingon language.
qar.
> wa' ghogh ghItlh vIQoyta': jatlhchuqwI' tlhIngan Hol.
> I've heard one audio tape: Conversational Klingon.
{ghogh ghItlh} "voice manuscript" Hmm. Consider also {ghogh ta}. I quite
like {jatlhchuqwI' tlhIngan Hol}. {ja'chuqwI'} might be better, because we
know {ja'} can be reflexive.
> wej latlh ghogh ghItlh vISuqta'be'.
> I haven't obtained the other tape yet.
{wej} is already negative, so you don't need the {-be'}. {wej vISuqta'} "I
haven't got it yet."
> paq ngevpa'Daq 'oH vIra'ta', 'ach wej pawpu'.
> I've ordered at the bookstore, but it hasn't arrived yet.
Even though a lot of canon compound nouns seem to be made of a verb + pa',
we don't have carte blanche to do this. Try something like: {ngevmeH pa'}
{paq Suy} {paq ngevwI' malja'}
> qaStaHvIS poH nI' 'oH vIloS.
> I'm waiting for it a long time.
You're talking about the process of waiting for it, so the suffix {-lI'},
indicating an action in progress, with a definite stopping point, would be
appropriate on {loS}.
> motlh, vIjatlhmeH Doch Daj vI'oghlaHbe' }:-(
> Usually, I can't think of something interesting to talk about.
qech vIchup:
pay' venglIjDaq paw tlhInganpu'na'. qaS nuq? ghu' yIDel. chay' vang qum?
chay' bIvang? chay' vang tlhInganpu'? mu'tlhegh puS DaqonmeH laHlIj'e'
yIlo' 'ej pab yIqeq.
jaS jangmo' Hoch, janglaH vay'.
Qov [email protected]
Beginners' Grammarian