tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Fri Nov 15 09:14:04 1996

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Re: <K'>vaD ghItlhlu''a'?

Well, I have once been arguing for "diphtongs" too and been converted,
so I try to pass this wisdom on }}8-{

Denny Shortliffe writes:
> 
> But your list of {vublemey} is IMHO deficient in that {aw}, {ay}, {ey},
> {Iy} and {oy} should be included as they are specifically mentioned in
> TKD, pp._16-17.  You've sorta covered these in your rules (b) and (d)
> above, but I think that including them as entries in the list of voobles
> would be a clearer, neater solution to the problem.  What do you think?
> 
in *response* to
> >> Given the above, it sounds like a lot of the fighting is over what to call
> >> things.  You could come up with a set of rules that produced exactly the
> >> same set of syllables by dividing things up differently, saying instead
> >> that after the consonant (which I called a Kronstint above to use made-up
> >> words that I could define as I wanted), there must come a vowel or a
> >> diphthong, with appropriate definitions and then restrictions on the end
> >> (only ' may follow a diphthong, rgh has its own exception, etc).  And
> >> that's as valid a description as this.  Because that's all these are:
> >> DESCRIPTIONS.  Emphasis on the DE-.  They are not PRESCRIPTIONS.  Do we
> >> know for *sure* that you can't have another consonant after -ay aside 
> >> from '?  No more than we know you can't have initial clusters.  All this
> >> is presumed from what we have and lack evidence for.
> >> 
which was said by ~mark in an earlier post.
 
Now for the sake of comparison let's actually do it:
 
1) All syllables begin with a single Kronstint (with the exception of the
   suffix -oy), where Kronstints are b,ch,D,gh,H,j,l,m,ng,p,q,Q,r,S,t,tlh,
   v,w,y,'.

2) all syllables have exactly one vooble, where voobles are defined as
   a,e,I,o,u, or exactly one voyble, where voybles are 
   defined as ay,aw,ey,ew,Iy,Iw,oy,uy, which follows the Kronstint.
 
3) A syllable may end with:
  
   a) nothing after the vooble or voyble
  
   b) a single Krownstint, where Krownstints are defined as being a 
      Kronstint other than w or y, after a vooble but not a voyble
 
   c) the structure "-rgh" (call it a cluster, a phoneme, whatever) after
      a vooble but not a voyble
 
   d) the Kronstint ' after a voyble

Now, if you still think, this is a 'neater' description, go ahead and
use it. You will still get the same 'legal' syllables.
 
HomDoq

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