tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Wed Jul 03 17:15:49 1996
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Re: KLBC: tlhIngan Hol yIjatlhtaH
- From: [email protected] (Alan Anderson)
- Subject: Re: KLBC: tlhIngan Hol yIjatlhtaH
- Date: Wed, 3 Jul 1996 19:19:55 -0500
SaraH writes:
>chuwI' jura''a'? [Does that command apply to beginners?]
This is an interesting twist on apposition; you're using both "us" and
{chu'wI'} [note the spelling] as the object of the verb at the same time.
It makes at least some sense, but I don't know if it's strictly legal.
I do know that I don't like it very much; it strains my brain a bit more
than I want to deal with.
>mu'tlheghHommey vIyaj neH. [I can only read simple sentences.]
Your first word says something like "minor sentences", which doesn't have
an obvious meaning to me. "Simple sentences" would be {mu'tlheghmey nap}.
>DIvI' Hol ghItlh neH 'e' qab. [Writing only English is bad...]
This is a common error. Phrases like "it is bad that..." dosn't translate
directly into Klingon. The pronoun "it" stands for the sentence that is
stated later, so the second sentence is actually the subject of the first.
We can use {'e'} only as the *object* of a sentence, but "be bad" doesn't
work with an object.
We don't know how to use a sentence as a subject, so the phrasing has to
be changed in order for it to be translated well. Maybe something like:
{DIvI' Hol neH ghItlhlu'chugh, qab jabbI'ID} "If only the Federation's
language is written, the data transmission is bad." Notice that {neH}
follows the *noun* here; {'oH ghItlh neH} means "he just writes it", but
you mean {'oH neH ghItlh} "he writes only it".
>'ach tlhIngan Hol ghItlh neH 'e' qabmeH chuwI'.
>[...but only writing Klingon is also bad.]
This has the same problem as the previous sentence, with another problem
tacked on to the end. Do you mean "it is bad for beginners"? You have
written "in order for beginners [misspelled] to be bad." The right "for"
to use here is {-vaD}. The only thing that should follow a verb is the
verb's subject, so {chu'wI'vaD} has to precede the verb.
>DIvI' Hol tlhIngan Hol je' ghItlhlaHmeH *KLBC*.\
>[For KLBC we can write both...]
I think you wanted {-vaD} here as well, but I'm not absolutely certain.
If you indeed mean "In order for KLBC to be able to write..." then you
have to put the purpose clause *before* the verb or noun it modifies.
Since there is no other verb in the sentence, however, you probably did
not mean that. Here's a possible rephrasing of your meaning: {DIvI' Hol,
tlhIngan Hol je ngaSlaH *KLBC* jabbI'ID} "a KLBC message can contain
english and Klingon" [note that {je} has no {'} at the end].
>naDev vI'ang. [...as I show here.]
"I reveal it here." maj.
>DIvI' Hol wIghItlhbe' neH Hoch. [No one should write just English.]
"All/we merely don't write english." This has the same dissonance between
the stated subject and the verb prefix as does your first sentence. I can
understand it after thinking about it for a while, but it's not obvious.
Looking at your english translation, I think {pagh} would be a more obvious
choice for the subject, but I can see how {Hoch} might be a better statement.
{DIvI' Hol neH ghItlhbe'nIS Hoch} "Everyone must not write only english."
Again, note the correct placement of {neH} for this meaning.
>jabbI'ID vIghItlh, <-mo'> vIyajbe'mo'.
>[I wrote an e-mail because I didn't understand <-mo'>.]
Fine. Some might object to the subordinate clause coming after the main
verb, but there's no strict rule prohibiting it from being at the end.
>DaH vIHar vIyaj leghlaH.
>[Now I believe I understand, as you can see.]
Ouch -- you blew it here, in a couple of ways. First, the sentence
"I believe I understand" should be {jIyaj 'e' vIHar}. While english
often leaves out the word "that", Klingon only leaves it out when the
second verb is {neH}. Second, {leghlaH} doesn't even come close to
meaning "as you can see". For this sort of meaning, I'd be tempted to
stretch the sentence-as-object construction ever so slightly, and add
something like {'ej 'e' DaleghlaH} after {DaH jIyaj 'e' vIHar}.
-- ghunchu'wI' batlh Suvchugh vaj batlh SovchoH vaj