tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sun Apr 28 11:06:20 1996

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Re: {lab} vs. {lI'}

>>> It just occurred to me, in trying to remember the difference
>>> between {lab} and {lI'}, think of a message as if it were 
>>> footbll. To send it, you {lab} [lob]. To receive it, you begin
>>> to say that you are "listening" but before you get to the "s"
>>> sound, you get hit in the belly with a Johnny Unitus bee-line
>>> pass. {lI'}
>>
>> {lab} is glossed as "transmit data (away from a place)" and
>> {lI'} is "transmit data (to a place)"; neither of them appear
>> to mean "receive data"
> 
>Okrand's choice of words was very bad in these definititions, but if you
>look at their actual useage in ST3 (the only canon usage for either term),
>{lab} is used to describe sending a message and {lI'} is used to describe
>receiving one. This occurs when the Genesis Project data is transmitted
>from Valkris to Kruge.
 
Not quite.  If we look at the actual dialog in ST3, we see that {lab} and 
{lI'} are both used in the sense of "transmit":
	Valkris:  HablI' Su' labbeH. 	"[Tranceiver] Ready to transmit."
	Kruge:	  De' yIlI'... DaH! 	"Transmit data... now!"
The words are glossed in TKD as:
	lI'  	   transmit data (to a place)
	lab        transmit data (away from a place)
And we have two additional examples from TKD:
	labbeH     "(The device) is ready to transmit data.
	vIlI'lI'   "I am transmitting (the data)."

What can we deduce? Two possibilities come to mind:

1) The verbs distinguish between the explicit (i.e. stated in the
sentence) presence or absence of an (in)direct object, either what is
being transmitted (the data) or where it's being sent (person or place).
{lab} refers to transmitting in general: no stated object; {lI'} assumes a
receptor for the transmission. So, Valkris is just telling Kruge she's
about to switch on her transmitter and he should turn on his recorder. 
Kruge activates a switch (as I recall) and tells her to "Transmit the 
data [to me]... now!" And in TKD, {labbeH} simply means that the device is 
OPERATIONAL, but {vIlIlI'} is "I am transmitting IT."

2) Interestingly, {lab} seems to refer to what the transmitting device
itself does, while {lI'} refers to the actions of the person operating it.
This idea is marred, somewhat, by the word {HablI'} "data tranceiving
device", which is formed from {lI'} and not {lab}. ({Hab} "be smooth" is 
of no help here.)

Note that these two interpretations are related. I would suggest that
Okrand wasn't interested in the specific type of transmission (general
broadcast vs. tight beam), or the direction _per se_ (send vs. receive). 
{lab} and {lI'} both mean "send". Okrand was trying to distinguish the
subject of the verb (device vs. person) and whether it could take an 
object.

Does anyone know if there are other verbs that make this distinction in 
the subject?

P.S.  Just for the hell of it, I have included an extract from my own
laboriously compiled Annotated Klingon Dictionary (AKD), which I searched
in collecting material for this post. I thought that others who have made
their own online dictionaries would be interested in how I organized mine.
N.B. This is an ASCII version of a document originally written in MS-Word
for DOS 6.0 format where I use different fonts to distinguish the sources
within an entry. I use plain text (English) and bold text (tlhIngan Hol)
for Okrand's canon, italics for my own suggestions, expansions and
coinings--including the usages developing on this Mailing List (ML)--and
small caps for Glen Proechel's suggestions (GP). In this extract, italics
and small caps have been converted into CAPS to easily identify what is
non-canon. 

-- Extract from my AKD ----------------------------------------------------- 
Hab  be smooth - Hab SoSlI' Quch Your mother has a smooth forehead!! PK
HablI'  data transceiving device, TRANSCEIVER, TRANSMITTER - HablI' Su'
   labbeH Ready to transmit. ST3;  MODEM (ML);  MAILING LIST (ML) 
   [now cf. jabbI'IDghom (ML)]
lab transmit data (away from a place), SEND/UPLOAD, POST EMAIL (ML) - labbeH
   (The device) is ready to transmit data. TKD - HablI' Su' labbeH Ready to
   transmit. ST3
lI'  transmit data (to a place), RECEIVE/DOWNLOAD, RETRIEVE EMAIL (ML) - 
   vIlI'lI' I am transmitting (the data). TKD - De' yIlI'... DaH Transmit
   data... now! ST3
Su'  Ready! Standing by! (excl, syn. SuH and 'eH) - SSS... mev! ba'! Do not
   do that! Sit! PK - SSS... baH Ready... fire! ST:MP - HablI' Su' labbeH.
   Ready to transmit. ST3
-beH  ready, set up (referring to devices) (#2) - pojbeH (The device) is
   set up to analyze it. labbeH (The device) is ready to transmit data. TKD
   - HablI' Su' labbeH Ready to transmit. ST3
-lI'  in progress;  -ING, PROGRESSING TOWARD A GOAL GP (#7) ["Although both
   -taH and -lI' describe continuous action, -lI' is used to indicate
   that the subject is in the process of doing something as part of
   his/her/its intention, viz., consciously performing an action. The
   progressive, on the other had, carried the sense that there was a
   specific end to the task, but it had not yet been achieved."] - chollI'.     
   It is getting closer. ["If a missile is getting closer, but its intended
   destination is not known, choltaH (with -taH continuous) would be more
   appropriate."] vIlI'lI' I am transmitting (the data) TKD;  ["specifies 
   that the action has an (intended) end or stopping point"] - De' qangeHlI'
   I AM SENDING YOU THE INFORMATION. (DB)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Steven 
(Still waiting for his copy of _HolQeD_ #17 to arrive! Lawrence!?)

_____________________________________________________________________________
Steven L. Boozer               |    			 How many ages hence
			       |    Shall this our lofty scene be acted over
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