tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Wed Apr 27 07:03:13 1994

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Re: Ahem....



This is mainly in response to Nick's "Ahem..", but I'd also like to comment
on something Nick wrote a while back on verbs nominalized with {-ghach}. The
basic jist of his post (which I've since lost) was that maybe Klingon verbs
with {-ghach} take a mandatory aspect marker just so that a bare root won't
be {-ghach}ed. He paralleled this to the fact that all verbs in Russian need
to be either continuous or perfective. I wish to debate this. Russian is
inflectional, and does not function using bare root verbs. In Klingon, you
see, a root and a stem are the same thing, but in inflectional languages like
Russian, a stem appearing alone cannot be a part of a legal structure, and
indeed would not be considered a normal word in the grammar of that
particular language. Klingon verbs do something Russian ones cannot do: They
can have a null aspect.

I don't find Nick's opinion in this case in sync with my line of reasoning as
far as the nature of {-ghach} is concerned. My argument of the fact that
Klingon grammar does not distinguish roots from stems really does not bring
us any nearer to any sort of conclusions, of course, as concerning {-ghach}. 

>cha' ghu' vIja'.

>charghwI'vaD ghu' wa'DIch vIja'. "StarTrek" DawI' lut [play] vagh tlhIngan
Hol
>SoQmey Daqonmo', Qapla'! wa' qechHommo' neH jIQochnIS. lut vagh vIqImtaHvIS,
>Kirk Duj pongmeH "'enterpray'" mu' lo'pu' tlha 'e' vIQoy. "'enterprI'"
>vIQoybe'. tlhIngan Hol jatpab [phonology] pabnISlu'mo', Dujvetlh vIpongmeH
>"'enterpIrayS" mu' vIlo'pu', "tlhIngan _QISmaS_ wa'maHcha' jaj" vIqontaHvIS.

I'll do this in DIvI' Hol, because otherwise you'll get swamped with bizarre
neologisms or vague compounds. I honestly can't bring myself to believe that
{'enterpIrayS} completely obeys Klingon phonology. (Btw, if you want some
great insights on Klingon phonology and phonetics, check out HolQeD 1:1,
Allen Wechsler's article is imesho a classic). Klingon never allows two
consecutive consanants, with three specific exceptions: {-rgh}, {-w'}, and
{-y'}. I think you're looking at {-ay} as a diphthong, when really that is a
less-than-accurate way to view it. Klaa on ST5 said something approaching
{'entepray'} which *would* follow tlhIngan jatpab (nice compound btw; so's
mu'tlheghpab). But I for one refuse to believe, after repeatedly listening to
this, among other lines from the film, that Klaa muttered any sound even near
{S} on the end of his word for "Enterprise". But that's beside the point.

I would like to point out that I also heard him say {qIrq}, which flat-out
sends jatpab down the tubes when it comes to foreign words. Actually, the
last sound of "Enterprise" is nothing like {S}. It's "Enterprize". The
closest Klingon has to [z] is {j}. But nobody heard {j}, did they. My take is
that Klingons would have Klingonized any foreign words or names into a
phonology that would best suit their phonological habits. All natural
languages do this anyways.

[All the Klingon text about how Nick wishes Krankor would read thru a couple
good books on linguistics so he can better function as a Grammarian, deleted]
[...]

Good advice to Qanqor. Slight apologetic flavor coming from Nick's text. That
can be good thing. It always dampens the potential for more flame wars
between them two. wejpuH. Anyways, I'm not a linguist, but am rapidly in the
process of becoming one. I've learned so much about linguistics itself just
by being involved with tlhIngan Hol.

De'wI'tej ghaH Qanqor'e' 'a Holtej ghaHbe'
Do'Ha'
HolQeD HaDchugh Qanqor vaj tlhIngan Hol'e' HaDlaHchu'qu'

>pItlh; DaHjaj Qu' latlh law' vIta'nIS. Qapla' boghajjaj, laDwI'.
>nIchyon jIH.

Aaaahhhhhhhh... I always feel a hint of masochistic exhiliration surging thru
my corporeum after reading massive amounts of Klingon text. Qapla'!

> /|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
>| "One must first know that traditionally a Japanese bus has carried not |
>| only a driver but one or more young girls who stand in the aisles and   |
>| sell tickets, announce stops, and in general console the passengers for |
>| the inadequacies and discomforts of this transient world."              \
>|               --- Roy Andrew Miller,  _The Japanese Language_,  p. 251   |
>||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
>\||||[email protected]||||||Transient Passenger|||||||Nick Nicholas||||
>==\||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
>      ()()                          ()()                            ()()

Nick finally has his sig. back. yay!


Guido#1, Leader of All Guidos


ghItlh 'o': "suffix" DamughmeH <'o'moHaq> yIlo'Qo' nIchyon
<mojaq>'e' yIlo'



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