tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Wed Apr 23 05:46:03 2008

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Re: Klingon WOTD: SanID (number)

Doq ([email protected])



Several people have been quoting this and it seems really strange to  
talk about centuries vs. years when the difference I would have  
otherwise interpreted would have been the difference between a time  
stamp and a time period. I would have thought that {cha' vatlh DIS  
ret} would mean "the time period encompassing the past 200 years",  
since {ret} is defined as "time period ago (past)". I'm talking about  
200 time periods of one year in the past each. Meanwhile {cha' vatlh  
ben} would be a moment in time of undetermined length which happened  
200 years ago, since {ben} means "years ago / years old". I'm talking  
about one moment 200 years ago.

{ret} is a length of time, with today marking its end. {ben} is a  
point in time measured back from today. That's what the glosses look  
like to me, anyway.

jav ben jISaw. jav ret be'nal vIghajtaH.

Actually, these could be combined. cha' ben wa'maH loS ret Duj  
vIghajtaH. That's a very concise way of saying that I acquired a ship  
sixteen years ago and ceased owning it two years ago. Literally, "Two  
years ago, I owned a ship for fourteen years." Since {ret} measures  
time backwards, the time stamp preceding it marks the end of the time  
period described by {ret}.

If that interpretation is not valid, then we've just lost a very  
valuable means of very efficient expression relating to time stamps  
and time spans.

Doq

On Apr 22, 2008, at 9:55 PM, [email protected] wrote:

> In a message dated 4/22/2008 09:36:34 AM Central Daylight Time,
> [email protected] writes:
>
>> Are you thinking of the phrases {vatlh DIS poH}
>> and {netlh DIS poH} mentioned in HQ 8.3:
>>
>>   With longer time periods, such as a century ({vatlh DIS poH}), or a
>>   period of 10,000 years (myriad, perhaps) ({netlh DIS poH}), the  
>> words
>>   {ret} or {pIq} may be used in place of {poH}, e.g., {cha' vatlh  
>> DIS poH}
>>   "two centuries", but {cha' vatlh DIS ret} "two centuries ago". The
>>   phrase {cha' vatlh ben} would mean "200 years ago". The choice of
>>   construction depends on what is being emphasized: in this case, the
>>   total number of centuries (two) or the total number of years (200).
>>
>> (Is {SaD DIS poH} "millennium" also mentioned in that HolQeD  
>> article?  It's
>> not in my notes.)
>>
>
> Your copy of the text of HQ 8.3, p. 3, is incomplete, and lacks  
> exactly the
> part about millennium:
>
> With longer time periods, such
> as a century ({vatlh DIS poH}),
> millennium ({SaD DIS poH}), or a
> period of 10,000 years ("myriad,"
> perhaps) ({netlh DIS poH}), the words
> {ret} or {pIq} may be used in place of
> {poH}, e.g., {cha' vatlh DIS poH} _two
> centuries_ , but {cha' vatlh DIS ret} _two
> centuries ago_.  The phrase {cha' vatlh
> ben} would mean "200 years ago."
> The choice of construction depends
> (p.4)
> on what is being emphasized: in this
> case, the total number of centuries
> (two) or the total number of years
> (200).
>
> lay'tel SIvten   </HTML>
>
>
>






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