tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu Jul 24 10:25:17 2003

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Re: OMF: BG, DaSov'a'?

At 08:55 AM Thursday 7/24/03, Christoph wrote:

>[Voragh wrote]
> >Your Klingon is pretty good, so I'll just give the corrected sentence
>
>vItulbej. vIngeHmeH, law'pu' rep vIqonpu'ghach.
>I certainly hope it (I hope so).

The verbs have different objects in each sentence.  In the first it's my 
comment to you, and in the second it's {QIn}.  For clarity try

   'e' vItulbej.  QIn vIngeHmeH ...

{'e'} "that" refers to the previous sentence, even when uttered by someone 
else.  See this exchange from ST6:

   Azetbur: notlh veS... 'a tugh manotlhchoH je maH.
            (War is obsolete, General...as we are in danger of becoming.)

   Kerla:   QamvIS Hegh qaq law' torvIS yIn qaq puS.
            ("Better to die on our feet than live on our knees.")

   Azetbur: 'e' neHbe' vavwI'.
            (That wasn't what my father wanted.)

   Chang:   Your father was killed for what he wanted.


>[Actually, I wanted to write "I should hope so" - but I have no idea
>how to write things like "should" "would").]

Klingon doesn't handle modals well, particularly the irrealis.  For 
emphasis, try {'e' vItulbej} or {'e' vItulqu'}.


>In order to send it, the writing-hours were many.

You can't use {-pu'} (perfective) on a simple quality since "This suffix 
indicates that an action is completed" (TKD 43).  Qualities are not 
actions; they're just states of being.  Of course, you can always turn a 
quality into an action verb with {-moH} or {-choH}, in which case you can 
then add the aspect suffix to that.


>[I wanted to say that it "took me hours" to write it, but I didn t find
>any way to write "took" or reword it as "needed many hours".]

qaStaHvIS rep(mey) law' QIn vIqontaH.
I wrote the message over many hours ("while many hours occurred").


> >> roD Quj *Daq QInmey*Daq jIghItlhtaH, tlhIngan QIn vIghItlhpu'.
> >> I wrote a message at a [game?] message board I usually write on.
> >
> >*{jabbI'IDghom} "mailing list, newsgroup, BBS" is what we normally use
> >on the tlhIngan_Hol List.  It was coined before {QIn} appeared in KGT.
>
>toH.  *website* tlhIngan Hol yejHaD lutu'lu'laH boSpu'wI' mu'mey ghoQ?
>Can one find a collection of these "slang words" on the KLI site?
>[Note: if not, it would be great to have]

That's an excellent idea.  Maybe a list of the few most common ones (like 
*{jabbI'IDghom}) should be in the FAQ.


> >>*OMF:BG* 'oH pongDaj.
> >>*OMF:BG* is it's name.
> >
> >*OMF:BG* 'oH pongDaj'e'.
>
>Why the " 'e' "?

When you have an equational ("A is/are B") sentence using a "pronoun as 
verb", the subject has to be tagged with {-'e'}.  It's one of those "just 
because" rules.  Cf. TKD (p. 68):

    There is no verb corresponding to English "to be" in Klingon. On
    the other hand, all pronouns (section 5.1) can be used as verbs,
    in the sense of "I am", "you are", etc. ... When there is a definite
    subject, it follows the pronoun and takes the {-'e'} "topic" suffix
    (see section 3.3.5):

       puqpu' chaH qama'pu''e'
       The prisoners are children.
       As for the prisoners, they are children.

       pa'DajDaq ghaHtaH la''e'
       The commander is in his quarters.
       As for the commander, he is in his quarters.

When there is no explicit subject, the {-'e'} is not mandatory:

   puqpu' chaH
   They are children.

   tlhIngan jIH
   I'm a Klingon.

In this case, if you use {-'e'} it's emphasizes the pronoun:

   puqpu' chaH'e'.
   THEY (and no one else) are children.

   tlhIngan jIH'e'
   *I* am a Klingon!  I am so a Klingon!  I'm the one who is a Klingon!


> >> *One Must Fall: BattleGrounds* 'oS 'oH qor "lujnISlu': vIq Daq" 
> DamaSchugh.
> >> It "means"/represents *One Must Fall: BattleGrounds* or "lujnISlu': vIq
> >> Daq" if you prefer.
> >
> >*One Must Fall: BattleGrounds*, <<lujnISlu': che'ronmey>> (DamaSchugh) 
> ghap 'oS.
> >*One Must Fall: BattleGrounds* 'oS pagh <<lujnISlu': che'ronmey>> 
> (DamaSchugh) 'oS je.
> >*One Must Fall: BattleGrounds* 'oS; DamaSchugh <<lujnISlu': che'ronmey>> 
> 'oS je.
> >
> >{che'ron} is "battlefield", which means the same thing as a "battle
> >ground".  *{vIQ Daq} "combat site" isn't bad, but it could also mean
> >something as small as a boxing ring.  *{ghobmeH Daq} "place for doing
> >battle" would be another way to go.
>
>Well, I didn't want to use "che'ron" because the word "battlefield" sounds 
>like
>any random place where a battle happened to be, at least I think it 
>does.  With
>"vIQ Daq" I meant some sort of arena, because the fighting (well, combat) is
>done at certain "battlegrounds" or arenas.

Hmm... must be the difference in our dialects.  Having served in the 
military, battlefield feels more specific than any old battleground.


>One last question though. Out of curiosity - why didn't you send this
>mail to the Mailing list?  Mistake or intention?

I thought I had.  For some reason the "reply" button must have selected 
your address out of the message and I didn't notice the "To" header.  I've 
forwarded my post and your reply to the List.


>potlhbe'. (Is there a word for "anyway"?)

Not that I know of.  If you want to minimize the importance - or emphasize 
the unimportance - try {potlhbe'qu'} "it's not very 
important",  {potlhbe'law'} "that seems not to be important", {potlhbe'bej} 
"it's certainly unimportant", etc.


>QaHlIjvaD, qatlho'.

Qay'be'.


-- 
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons

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