tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue May 05 16:38:11 1998
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Re: KLBC: A few sentences (back after negelcting klingon for a few m
- From: Qov <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: KLBC: A few sentences (back after negelcting klingon for a few m
- Date: Tue, 05 May 1998 16:35:11 -0700
At 08:34 98-05-05 -0700, Peter Schuller wrote:
}(if this message appears twice, I apologize. But the first one seems to
}have been lost, as I sent it almost 24h ago, and it hasn't reached the
}list)
}
}[jItlhabpu' jIH 'e'mo' tlhingan Hol jIghojtaHbe']
}(Because I've been busy, I've stopped learning Klingon.)
}
}[tlhab] is probably wrong and I'm uncertain about
}the negation of [taH]
Yep. {tlhab} is "be free" not "be busy," and even at that I wouldn't use it
to mean free as in "are you free next Tuesday?" unless I was addressing
someone who was behind bars, waiting for parole. The perfective isn't right
for an ongoing action: it's purpose is to indicate completion. Watch the
{I} in {tlhIngan}: not "i". There is controversy over the negation of
{-taH}, but there's an established way to say that you stop doing something,
so we'll use that instead, straightening out a very oddly placed {'e'} with
a possibly taboo suffix, as we go. Also the prefix for I-it is {vI-} not {jI-}.
When you're writing a complex sentence in Klingon, start by writing the
simple sentences, then connect them up. It helps get the connections in the
right places.
We don't have a word for "be busy" but you can say what you were doing, or say
latlh Qu'mey vIbuStaH - I was focusing on other tasks (on an ongoing basis)
tlhIngan Hol vIghojtaH - I study Klingon (on an ongoing basis)
vImev - I stop [it].
The first sentence is the reason for the others and the the second sentence
is the object of the third sentence. Put a {-mo'} on the verb of the
sentence that is the cause (4.2.9 - addendum), and a {'e'} in the object
position of the sentence that takes a sentence as its object (6.2.5 -
(compare with {bIjatlh 'e' yImev} in the appendix)), and you get:
latlh Qu'mey vIbuStaHmo' tlhIngan Hol vIghojtaH 'e' vImev
Because I'm focusing on other tasks I will stop studying Klingon.
Because I was focussing on other tasks, I stopped studying Klingon.
Because I will be focussing on other tasks, I will stop studying Klingon.
I'd recommend adding a timestamp of some sort in the Klingon, maybe even two
timestamps, to make up for the tense lost in translation.
}Maybe [ghojmevpu'] is better?
The use of {mev} as part of another word is unique to {mevyap}. Do not
merge any verb with another unless Okrand has done it first. That is not
the way Klingon sentences are built up.
{jIghojpu' 'e' vImev} "I stopped learning"
There is a rule against using a type 7 suffix on the verb whose object is
{'e'}, so the perfective ends up on the other verb, if perfective is needed.
}[tlhingan Hol jIghojqa' jIH]
}(I'm taking it up again.)
Getting better. Misspelling on {tlhIngan} again, and another messed prefix.
See section 4.1.1 on the prefix agreeing with the object AND subject. "I"
learn "Klingon": subject "I" - first person singular. Object: "Klingon",
third person singular, thus prefix {vI-}.
You know that pronouns are optional, right? The use of {jIH} here
emphasises that *you* are taking it up again, as opposed to someone else.
}[*hard/alot/much/good* jIHaD 'e' jInID jIH]
}(I'll try to study hard)
A good one for this idea is {batlh}. And again, your prefix much match the
third person object ({'e'} is third person), and your pronoun isn't necesary.
batlh jIHaD 'e' vInID - I'll try to study with honour.
}[mu'tlhegh QaQ 'e'vaD mu'mey lugh 'e' jItu' Qatlh]
}(It is difficult to find the words needed for the sentence to sound good)
What you're doing here with {'e'} doesn't make much sense. The one and only
purpose of {'e'} is to sit in the object position of a verb that has the
entire previous sentence as its object. {lugh} doesn't take an object, so
you can't use {'e'}. Also, finding deliberately is {Sam}. {tu'} is find as
in "I find that airline pilots always have nice sunglasses" or "I found this
in the street" (assuming you weren't looking for it).
Take your sentence apart and figure out what the subject and objects are.
mu'tlhegh QaQ - a good sentence
mu'mey lugh - the right words
vISam - I find [them]
Qatlh - [something] is difficult.
Here's one way you might put them together:
mu'tlhegh QaQvaD mu'mey lugh vISamnISmo' Qatlh Qu'wIj.
mu'tlhegh QaQvaD - for a good sentence (remember that {-vaD} is a noun
suffix but you need to put it on the modifying adjective if there is one)
mu'mey lugh vISamnISmo' - because I have to find the correct words
Qatlh Qu' - my task is difficult.
You could also use {-meH} to assemble this meaning. Check it out in section
6.2.4.
You get better at finding words with practice. When I started out I used to
find the words first and then come up with ideas for them to express, rather
than the other way around. It taught me the words and helped me practice
the grammar with less page flipping.
If what I'm trying to say isn't clear to you, follow up and ask. I'm
reading a linguistics textbook that's way over my head at the moment, and I
expect I've either overcompensated and insulted your intelligence or else
it's rubbed off on me and I'm unintelligible.
Qov [email protected]
Beginners' Grammarian