tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu May 29 19:37:10 2014
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Re: [Tlhingan-hol] -nIS : whose volition?
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-CA link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>When I say volition I am quoting TKD 4.2.2. I will further quote: “suffixes of this type express how much choice the subject has about the action described or how predisposed the subject is to doing it.”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Bellerophon, modeler [mailto:[email protected]] <br><b>Sent:</b> May 29, 2014 19:20<br><b>To:</b> [email protected]<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tlhingan-hol] -nIS : whose volition?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>In the examples you cite, the "need" is relative to some purpose, which is implied. Also, volition does not necessarily coincide with "need," particularly if the supposed need serves someone else's ends. Perhaps Klingons assert different views of the purpose to be served when they use the ending {nIS}.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>However, you make a good point. Similar misuse of "need" in such contexts in English (and other Earth languages) does not mean that Klingons also indulge in such verbal posturing. It seems somehow indirect, and therefore un-Klingon.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>~'eD<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 9:25 PM, Robyn Stewart <<a href="mailto:[email protected]" target="_blank">[email protected]</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><p><span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Once again I am seeking to satisfy the widest possible range of competent Klingon speakers with my interpretation of TKD and canon for the beginners’ course.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p><br><span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>We know from TKD that type 2 verb suffixes represent the volition of the subject to perform the action of the verb.</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>We also have the sentence</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>from Star Trek V:</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>DungDaq legh 'ej QotnIStaH romuluSngan be'pu' = Romulan women belong on their backs.</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Clearly</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>in this sentence</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Korrd is not describing the actual volition of Romulan women,</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>nor what he believes about what they personally need,</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>but his own opinion, what they would need to do to satisfy him, similar to us saying,</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>“That food needs to be in my belly.”<br><br>I think I say</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>and hear</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>things like this</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>in Klingon</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>all the time. </span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Are we</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>correct? Is Korrd’s line an aberration</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>or regionalism? Would you feel it</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>correct or</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>incorrect to advise beginners to avoid this</span> <span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>usage? </span><o:p></o:p></p><p><span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Would you accept the sentence:</span><o:p></o:p></p><p><span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>jagh mernIS bachlIj. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p><span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Clearly the shot itself has no volition, it is the speaker (addressing the gunner) who has the need.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p><span style='font-family:"Courier New"'>Discuss.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>_______________________________________________<br>Tlhingan-hol mailing list<br><a href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a><br><a href="http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol" target="_blank">http://mail.kli.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>-- <br>My modeling blog: <a href="http://bellerophon-modeler.blogspot.com/" target="_blank">http://bellerophon-modeler.blogspot.com/</a><br>My other modeling blog: <a href="http://bellerophon.blog.com/" target="_blank">http://bellerophon.blog.com/</a><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></body></html>
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