tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Fri Jan 22 09:57:49 2010
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RE: jatlh vs. ja'
Quvar:
>>> I do not intend to flatter you, but I also tend to use {ja'} more like
>>> "report" or "tell a story", while {jatlh} is the "action of talking".
SuStel:
>>Specifically, {ja'} "tell, report" seems to refer to informing and
>>ordering, while {jatlh} "speak, say" has a more general meaning of
>>speech of any kind.
lay'tel SIvten:
>To me it's all about the kind of object I want the verb to have. If I
>want to mention the audience spoken to (patient), I use {ja'}. If I
>want to mention the spoken utterance or language itself (focus), then
>I use {jatlh}.
Both {ja'} and {jatlh} can be used for mentioning the spoken utterance. Okrand writes in TKD (p. 67):
Similarly, with verbs of saying (say, tell, ask, etc.), {'e'} and
{net} are not used. The two phrases simply follow one another, in
either order:
{qaja'pu' HIqaghQo'} or {HIqaghQo' qaja'pu'}
I told you not to interrupt me.
This is literally, "I told you, 'Don't interrupt me!'" or "'Don't
interrupt me!' I told you." [...] An aspect marker (here, {-pu'}
"perfective") may always be attached to the verb of saying,
regardless of whether it is the first or second verb.
Voragh:
|Finally, for those unfamiliar with the origin of {ja'}, marqoS tells
|us that in ST3:
|
| The Klingon is {qama'pu' jonta' neH!}; the original script had the
| English as "I told you: engine only!" ({qa-} "I/you"; *{ma'} "tell";
| {-pu'} "perfective"; {jonta'} "engine"; {neH} "only"), but it got
| rewritten in the subtitles to "I wanted prisoners! " ... The verb
| {ma'}, meaning "to tell", was changed to {ja'} to remove the ambi-
| guity of the sentence and make the substitution less obvious.
Mutatis mutandis, this becomes a variant of the TKD example above:
qaja'pu' jonta' neH
"I told you: engine only!"
************************************************************************
From: "Marc Okrand"
Newsgroups: msn.onstage.startrek.expert.okrand
Date: 29 Jun 1997
Subject: Re: Some quick questions...
Neal Schermerhorn wrote:
> 1) Does qajatlh mean anything? Some feel this is poor grammar. I'm not
> sure what to think. Can jatlh take an object other than a language?
The object of {jatlh} "speak" is that which is spoken. Thus, it's OK
to say "speak a language," for example:
{tlhIngan Hol Dajatlh} "you speak Klingon"
But it's also OK to say "speak an address, speak a lecture," for example:
{SoQ Dajatlh} "you speak an address" or, more colloquially,
"you deliver an address" or "you make a speech"
To say simply:
{jatlh} "he/she speaks"
implies "he/she speaks it," where "it" is a language or a lecture or
whatever.
[... snip ...]
There's another wrinkle to this. The verb {jatlh} can also be used when
giving direct quotations:
{tlhIngan jIH jatlh} "he/she says, 'I am a Klingon'"
{jatlh tlhIngan jIH} "he/she says, 'I am a Klingon'"
(With verbs of saying, such as {jatlh}, the phrase that is being said or
cited may come before or after the verb.)
If the speaker is first or second person, the pronominal prefix indicating "no object" is used:
{tlhIngan jIH jIjatlh} "I say, 'I am a Klingon'"
{tlhIngan jIH bIjatlh} "you say, 'I am a Klingon'"
There are instances where the pronominal prefix marks a big distinction in meaning:
{tlhIngan Hol Dajatlh} "you speak Klingon"
{tlhIngan Hol bIjatlh} "you say, 'Klingon language'"
[that is "you say the phrase 'Klingon language'"]
************************************************************************
--
Voragh
Canon Master of the Klingons