tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu Dec 13 13:14:32 2007

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Re: jIHtaHbogh naDev vISovbe'

Robyn Stewart ( [KLI Member] [Hol po'wI']

The explanation I'm most fond of is that it's an idiom, like mIv je 
DaS, and not subject to analysis.

At 07:37 AM 12/13/2007, you wrote:
>At 11:31 PM Wednesday 12/12/2007, QeS wrote:
> >mu'tlhegh {nuqDaq 'oH puchpa''e'?} lubopbogh QIn vIlaD, 'ej Voragh wa'
> >QInDaq mu'tlheghvam vItu':
> >
> >   jIHtaHbogh naDev vISovbe'
> >   I'm lost. TKD [p.172]
> >
> >chay' bopoj? vIpoj 'e' vInID 'ach Hatlaw'. mu'tlheghHom wa'DIch
> >'ay' 'oHchugh {naDev}'e', Hat (mu'tlhegh bI'reSDaq poHmey Daqmey je
> >perbogh DIp lulo'nISlu'), 'ej mu'tlheghHom cha'DIch 'ay' 'oHchugh, Hat
> >je (KCDDaq mu'tlhegh {Dajatlhbogh vIyajbe'} wIghaj, 'ach Soj DIp'e'
> >ghajnIS mojaq {-bogh} lulo'bogh wotmey roD net Qublaw').
> >
> >chay' pojnISlu'?
>A few years ago qoror suggested analyzing this puzzling sentence as:
>    "I don't know the area around here that I'm at."
>This (colloquial?) expression seems to work because {-taH} on a pronoun
>implies location to a Klingon speaker, especially when accompanied by a
>noun with the locative suffix {-Daq}.  But {naDev} is an exception:
>TKD 27:  It is worth noting at this point that the concepts expressed by
>the English adverbs "here", "there", and "everywhere" are expressed by
>nouns in Klingon: {naDev} "hereabouts", {pa'} "thereabouts", {Dat}
>"everywhere". These words may perhaps be translated more literally as "area
>around here," "area over there," and "all places," respectively. Unlike
>other nouns, these three words are never followed by the locative suffix.
> >SKI: QeS 'utlh is puzzled about the TKD sentence {jIHtaHbogh naDev
> >vISovbe'}. No matter which clause {naDev} is parsed into, it seems to
> >be illegal, unless it's further evidence for headless relative clauses.
>For the beginners, the other "headless relative" QeS is referring to is:
>    Dajatlhbogh vIyajlaHbe'
>    I find no match for what you just said. (KCD .wav file)
>That's the only one I can think of this early in the morning.  Are there
>any others?
>Ca'Non Master of the Klingons

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