tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Dec 18 09:55:56 2006

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Re: Return With Honour

...Paul ([email protected]) [KLI Member] 

On Mon, 18 Dec 2006, Doq wrote:
> qatlh potlh mu' <<bIcheghDI'>>?  mu'tlhegh yInapmoH:
>
> batlhlIj potlh law' yInlIj potlh puS.
>
> bItlheDDI' teH. bIDachtaHvIS teH. bIcheghDI' teH. reH teHtaH.

nuq DamughmeH bInID?  Damughchu' DaneHchugh, yapbe' mu'tlheghvetlh. 
mu'tlhegh wa'DIch rurbogh qech'e' neH Damugh DaneHchugh, yap 
mu'tlheghvetlh.

What are you trying to translate?  If you want to translate it perfectly, 
that sentence is insufficient.  If you want to translate only an idea 
similar to the first sentence, that sentence is sufficient.

> On Dec 17, 2006, at 12:49 PM, Alan Anderson wrote:
>> ja' naHQun:
>>> "I'd rather you come home in a coffin, then come home dishonoured.".
>> bIcheghDI' lom quv qaq law' loD quvHa' qaq puS.

It comes down to the question of how exactly you want to translate 
something.  There are a number of Klingon phrases, I'm sure, that convey 
the same kind of sense as the original quote -- but the intention was to 
try to use the poetic imagery, which is not present in existing phrases 
(or in your translation).  Let's take a simpler, similar phrase:  "You 
will return in a coffin."  There are plenty of ways to translate this:

bIHegh -- "You will die."

Short, sweet, conveys the same ultimate meaning, but lacks, for a better 
word, "panache".

DaHoHlu' -- "You will be killed."

Short, sweet, probably more precise when talking about a warrior going to 
battle...  But again, lacks panache.

chegh lomlIj neH -- "Only your corpse will return."

Now we've got some poetry going, the intention is much closer to the 
original, but it's still not a literal translation.

lom ngaSwI'Daq bIchegh -- "You will return in a coffin."

Assuming /lom ngaSwI'/ is a suitable phrase for 'coffin', this is a very 
literal translation of the original.

All four (and I'm sure there are more we can come up with) are "valid" 
translations, but they span a range from "recast to simplicity" to 
"literal translation".  Klingon is often succinct -- but not always.  One 
would argue, why say:

qaStaHvIS wa' ram loS SaD Hugh SIjlaH qetbogh loD.

when you could just say:

nuv law' vIHoHlaH.

Poetry.  :)

...Paul

          ** ...Paul, [email protected], Insane Engineer **
   ** Visit Project Galactic Guide http://www.galactic-guide.com/ **
         "I used to be confused, but now I'm just not sure."

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