tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Fri Oct 21 08:31:57 2005
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Re: targhmey
ghunchu'wI':
> >Must I remind you *again* of the counterexamples from TKD?
> > nuqDaq 'oH Qe' QaQ'e'
> > nuqDaq 'oH puchpa''e'
> >It's NOT a rule.
lay'tel SIvten:
> >And even if it *is* a rule, albeit unwritten, it still has canon
> >exceptions.
QeS la':
>ter'eS also makes a good point in observing that these counterexamples are
>both questions; I just searched my own canon database, and of the dozen or
>so examples of pronoun plus {-taH} I turned up, not one was a question. The
>reverse may not be true, and this may be an artefact of the small sample
>size (I only found about a dozen examples of pronoun + {-taH} all up), but
>it's probably something to consider.
I searched my notes for more counterexamples and here's the complete list
(I think):
nuqDaq 'oH Qe' QaQ'e'
Where is a good restaurant? [TKD]
nuqDaq 'oH puchpa''e'
Where is the bathroom? [TKD, CK, PK, Radio Times]
nuqDaq 'oH jengva''e'
Where is the plate? [KGT 33]
nuqDaq 'oH ngop'e'
Where are the plates? [KGT 33]
nuqDaq bIH ngop'e'
Where are the plates? (childish error) [KGT 34]
ter'eS is right: These are all questions, and all with {nuqDaq}. Even the
childish error over the inherently plural noun omits {-taH}. The pattern
for asking where something is generally is clearly {nuqDaq PRONOUN
NOUN'e'?} (Perhaps {-taH} is omitted since the location is completely
unknown; thus asking for its *continuous* location would be
pointless.) So my revised "rule" is:
Specific statement: [NOUN1]Daq [PRONOUN]taH [NOUN2]'e'.
bIQ'a'Daq 'oHtaH 'etlh'e'
The sword is in the ocean. [KGT]
General question: nuqDaq [PRONOUN] [NOUN2]'e'?
nuqDaq 'oH 'etlh'e'
Where is the sword?
Now the question becomes: How does one ask a specific question (i.e.
referring to a specific location)?
? bIQ'a'Daq 'oH'a' 'etlh'e'
? bIQ'a'Daq 'oHtaH'a' 'etlh'e'
Is the sword in the ocean?
But since I can find no examples, it's possible that my second option might
be understood as "Is the sword STILL in the ocean?" (I.e. I know it was
there before, but is it still there now?)
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons