tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Jun 01 08:09:02 2004

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{'Iq} vs. {tlhoy}

Steven Boozer ([email protected]) [KLI Member] 

Voragh:
> >{QIn 'Iq} "too many messages"
> >
> >   vIlaDchu'meH QIn 'Iq boqonta'
> >   you've written too many messages for me to read perfectly
> >   (i.e. I'm a beginner and read Klingon too hesitantly)
> >
> >   vIlaDta'meH QIn 'Iq boqonta'
> >   you've written too many messages for me to read through (completely)
> >   (i.e. I can't finish them all!)

De'vID:

>Voragh, thanks for the suggestions.  As always, very thorough.
>I have a question about the use of <'Iq> with <-meH> though.
>
>In the above, it reads to me like "you've written too many
>messages, so that I read them through (completely)".  That is,
>you have written so many messages, for the purpose of having
>me completely read them through.  It sounds like the speaker
>is accusing the listeners of deliberately writing too many
>messages, which results in the speaker reading them through.

Maybe I tried to be too concise.  How about this:

   QIn 'Iq boqonta';  Hoch vIlaDlaHta'be'.
   You have written too many messages; I cannot read them all through.

The idea was in not being able to finish reading one message before the 
next one arrives; i.e. I read  Klingon too slowly and only have time to 
skim them.  This may work better without the second {-ta'}:

   QIn 'Iq boqonta';  Hoch vIlaDlaHbe'.
   You have written too many messages; I cannot read them all.

>The question is, am I misreading this, or is the <'Iq> in the
>wrong place, or should it perhaps be <tlhoy>?

I think this would work with either, though the difference is subtle:

   tlhoy QIn boqon!
   You're writing too many messages!  (i.e. You're writing too much;
   you're monopolizing my time.  Give it a rest!)

   QIn 'Iq boqon!
   You're writing too many messages!  (i.e. There are too many messages;
   my mailbox is filling up.  Enough already!)

Here's Okrand on {tlhoy} vs. {'Iq} in HolQeD 8.3:

   When {tlhoy} is used, it denotes that the action expressed by the verb
   is what is being overly done or done too much. Thus the sentence:
      {tlhoy qagh vISop}   "I eat too much gagh, I eat gagh
                            excessively, I overeat gagh"
   expresses the notion that the eating is excessive, not that the amount
   of gagh is. [...] When {tlhoy} is used, it denotes that the action
   expressed by the verb is what is being overly done or done too much.
   ... To express the idea of "too much gagh" or "too many tribbles," the
   verb {'Iq} "be too many, be too much" is used adjectivally. For example:
      {yIHmey 'Iq vIlegh}   "I see too many tribbles."
      {qagh 'Iq vISop}      "I eat too much gagh."
   Sometimes, the word {law'qu'} "be very many" ... is translated "be too
   many." If the context is clear, this is acceptable, but if it important
   to stress the idea of "overly many, overly much, more than there ought
   to be,"' {tlhoy} or {'Iq} is usually employed.



-- 
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons

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