tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu Jun 12 16:49:22 2003
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Re: Star Trek monologue
- From: "David Trimboli" <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: Star Trek monologue
- Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 17:42:47 -0400
>Tyler Fisher:
>> >>> 'ejDo' 'entepray' lengmey bIH lengmeyvam'e'.
>
>ter'eS:
>> >> Shouldn't this be {'enterpray' 'ejDo'}? I thought we even
>> >> had canon for this.
>
>Voragh:
>> > nImbuS wejDaq 'ejDo' 'entepray' ngeHlu'pu'
>> > The starship Enterprise has been dispatched to Nimbus III. ST5
>> >
>> > tera' vatlh DIS poH cha'maH loS bong QongmeH qItI'nga' Duj tI'ang
>>ghompu'
>> > DIvI' 'ejDo' 'entepray'
>> > A sleeper ship of this [K'Tinga] class, the T'Ong, was encountered in
>>the
>> > 24th century by the USS Enterprise. S15
>> >
>> > DIvI' 'ejDo' 'entepray'Daq Dajollu'
>> > Get beamed aboard the USS Enterprise. STX
>> >
>> > Go figure. As always, the Enterprise gets to break the rules!
>
>SuStel:
>>I see
>>(a) no reason to assume that /'ejDo' 'entepray'/ is breaking any rule, and
>From: Steven Boozer <[email protected]>
>
>What about:
>
> qIvo'rIt toQDuj 'oH tlhIngan wo' Duj pagh'e'
> The Imperial Klingon Vessel Pagh is a K'Vort-class Bird-of-Prey. S7
>
>Ship type {toQDuj} follows proper (class) name.
So? One is a genitive phrase, the other is apposition.
*Constitution* 'ejDo' 'entepray'
qIvo'rIt toQDuj
"K'Vort class Bird of Prey" is a genitive phrase. One word is not
semantically equivalent to the other. The first modifies the second.
tlhIngan wo' Duj pagh
"Imperial Klingon Vessel Pagh" is apposition with "Imperial Klingon Vessel"
and "Pagh." The two fit into the same semantic role in the sentence. The
first does not modify the second.
>You're right, though, in that there are counter-examples:
>
> tlhIngan may'Duj, qItI'nga'
> Klingon Battle Cruiser, K'Tinga Class. S15 (title)
This is no different than the English:
tlhIngan may'Duj, qItI'nga'
Klingon Battle Cruiser, K'Tinga class
qItI'nga' tlhIngan may'Duj
K'Tinga class Klingon Battle Cruiser
In the first phrase, the final word /qItI'nga'/ will always be a sentence
fragment. It's a genitive construction spoken out of order (just like the
English).
> ... bong QongmeH qItI'nga' Duj tI'ang ghompu' DIvI' 'ejDo' 'entepray'
> A sleeper ship of this class, the T'Ong, was encountered ... by the
> USS Enterprise. S15 (text)
That's a colloquial translation.
There's no rule-breaking going on here. You're just not seeing the
difference between a genitive construction and apposition.
SuStel
Stardate 3446.6
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