tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sun Mar 21 21:21:31 1999
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Re: Aspect
In a message dated 3/21/99 2:07:15 PM Eastern Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:
<< =======================
> TKD 4.7 DOES use the words "aspect," "perfective" and "continuous." Admit
it.
The words are there in black and white!
No one denies this.
> TKD 4.7 DOES NOT explain clearly the proper use of these words.
Yes it does. If you pay attention to the given examples, you would understand
aspect clearly as the rest of us do.
>It gives very
few examples.
And these examples are completely accurate and useful for those of us who
considered them and used them to form a basis to properly use it when speaking
Klingon.
>Thanks to voragh and some persons who have provided me with the
sentences in which MO has used Aspect, I realize that Okrand does have a
deeper understanding of Aspect than he has revealed in TKD.
Mark Okrand is a linguist. He should.
> TKD 4.7 says that "perfective" OFTEN translates into English as simple past
tense. What about the times it does not translate as simple past tense. TKD
does not explain this, that I can find.
USe time stamps or some other way to convey the idea. Not hard.
I have had to look at MO's canon
relevations to attempt to understand when "perfective" means much more.
Referring back to my college linguistics courses textbooks have helped me
tremendously in understanding MO's understanding.
College linguistics is irrelevant here. This language (for the most part) is
not taught in college, and its usage of aspect may differ from those languages
you've studied.
> In conclusion, we do need to understand the correct meaning of Aspect to
understand how Klingon uses it.
Look in TKD. The examples are there.
>Your claim that you can use it without
understanding what it really means from professional sources, but from TKD's
scant usage and explanations alone, are not only risky, but in some ways
outright wrong.
Using TKD's definition of aspect is correct, and has nothing to do with any
outside text. Get this through your head: Aspect tells whether an action is
complete or not, a continuous event or a single one. No more, no less. Who
cares what Mandarin Chinese or Booki laka la flooki highlanders from South
America say about aspect. We speak Klingon. How Klingon handles aspect is
all that is relevant. All else should be left to its respective language
list.
>I have noted that you might think {-pu'} refers to
completion. WRONG!!!
RIGHT! Look in the book. -pu' indicates an action is complete. To quote Tom
Servo: "Duh."
>This is the very reason we need to learn well what
"perfective" really means. TKD's explanations are not enough. We must study
MO's sentences using Aspect. We may need many more of his accurate
sentences.
As we get a larger sampling, we all can be more accurate.
> peHruS
>>
T'Lod