tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Jun 30 15:58:02 1997
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Re: KLBC: qIm/qImHa'
- From: "David Trimboli" <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: KLBC: qIm/qImHa'
- Date: Mon, 30 Jun 97 22:55:08 UT
[email protected] on behalf of Qermaq wrote:
> qIm = pay attention, concentrate (v)
>
> The definition is of the intransitive sense of "concentrate". In fact, since
> we have buS = concentrate on (v) as well, qIm clearly is an intransitive
verb.
This has always been my preferred argument, but it's not a certain thing.
In Star Trek V, Captain Klaa says {HeDaj yIqIm}, which is translated, "Track
her course!" This line is certainly loosely translated, and I am uncertain as
to whether it is one sentence or a sentence fragment and a sentence. One
might consider it to be {HeDaj! yIqIm!} "Her course! Pay attention!" I'm
less than certain about this one; it very well may be just one sentence.
That said, there's no reason not to have redundancy in a language. It makes
it funny, when in Conversational Klingon, Okrand says {yIqIm! yIbuS!} and
Michael Dorn translates "Pay attention and concentrate." (Disregarding the
transitivity question - no pun intended - this suggests to me that {buS}
indicates an active removal of all possible distractions, while {qIm} means
simply to keep the object in sight and mind.)
> We also have in TDK qImHa' = disregard (v). I cannot think of a useful
> meaning
> of "disregard" that is intransitive. (Neither can Webster!) The word always
> takes an object.
This is further evidence that {qIm} is transitive. The intransitive argument
is that in translating {qImHa'}, being simply the undoing of {qIm}, Okrand
chose something that was less than adequate. I'm not sure I buy this, and
this whole topic has virtually convinced me that {qIm} really is transitive,
whether I want it to be or not!
> There is a definite conflict between the suffixed and unsuffixed verb - it
> does not seem that -Ha' should suddenly change an intransitive verb, which
as
> I have shown doesn't need to be forced into a transitive role, into a
> transitive verb!
This does seem unlikely.
> We also have, from TKW, buSHa' = ignore (v). Seems to me "disregard" and
> "ignore" differ differently than "concentrate" and "concentrate on". I would
> assume buSHa' is transitive, since the root verb is, and we would say
> HIbuSHa'Qo' = Don't ignore me!
Sounds good.
> (And we all know *someone* is going to
> run with this where they ought not to, and say that this means taDHa' = melt
> (v.t.) and other such nonsense!)
The subject of {taD} is the thing which becomes frozen. (In KCD, the command
{petaD} shows this.) {taDHa'} would mean "unfreeze."
When we were young, my brother and I played the game of "Freeze and Unfreeze."
When one would call out "freeze!" the other would have to stop dead, in
whatever position he was in. When the other shouted "unfreeze," the he would
start moving again. I could see this game played with the commands {taD} and
{taDHa'}.
> Sustel,
Two of the capital {S}, please!
> yIqeltaH 'e' vISov!
"I know that consider!" You really can't use an imperative as the first
sentence of a Sentence As Object. Perhaps you meant
bIqeltaH 'e' vISov
I know that you are considering (things in general).
Or better yet,
mu'meyvam DaqeltaH 'e' vISov
I know you are considering these words.
> DuH Dawuqbogh Daja'neS (DawuqlaHchugh!).
pItlh.
--
SuStel
Beginners' Grammarian
Stardate 97497.5