tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Wed Jan 11 08:30:14 2006
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Re: walk two miles
Quvar:
> >>how would I say that that I traveled or walked a specific distance,
> >>e.g. two miles? Does it make sense to say {cha' qelI'qam jIleng}??
Voragh:
> >Quvar asks a very good question. My first inclination is to do it exactly
> >the way he did, with {cha' qelI'qam} as a sort of adverbial stamp.
QeS:
>{vIleng}. But for my part, I think this is reasonable.
Voragh:
> >I'm not sure about using {vI-}. The object of {leng} is a location, with
> >or without {-Daq}. In this it works like {ghoS}:
QeS:
>Ah. Yes, I had forgotten. Nevertheless, *{cha' qelI'qam jIleng} is not just
>semantically insensible, but out-and-out ungrammatical: in that sentence,
>per Okrand's interview which you cite, {cha' qelI'qam} would have no
>function in the sentence when the prefix {jI-} is used.
Even as an indirect indication of time, you need an subordinate clause:
qaStaHvIS cha' rep jIleng.
I travelled for two hours.
? [VERB]taHvIS cha' qelI'qam jIleng.
I travelled for two kellicams.
I travelled during two kellicams.
Voragh:
> >But on second thought I wonder if we need a verb with {-taHVIS}. But what
> >verb? Perhaps {qaS} "occur, happen"? Hmm... Can a distance occur in
> Klingon?
> >
> > ? qaStaHvIS cha' qelI'qam jIleng.
> >
> >Although {cha' qelI'qam} is measuring how far you walked, in effect you're
> >using it to say how long you walked: i.e. for (the time it took to travel)
> >two kellicams.
>(I don't think {qaS} is appropriate for use with a spatial noun.)
Probably not. But then we come back to the question of what verb can be
used, if any.
Using {cha' qelI'qam} as the object of {vIleng} might work only if Klingons
see it as referring to an unnamed place or point two kellicams away, not as
a two kellicam stretch of distance. Something similar to English "I
travelled the two miles" (i.e. the previously mentioned distance to my
previously mentioned destination) perhaps?
Voragh:
> >and Okrand used {leng} as an example in HolQeD 12/1998:
> ...
> >yuQDaq jIleng
> >I roam (around/about) on the planet. (HQ [12/1998])
QeS:
>Hmmm... so paralleling this, what about ??{cha' qelI'qamDaq jIleng} "I
>travel on two kellicams"?
More likely something like "I travelled (with)in the two kellicam area"
(e.g. a two kellicam wide neutral zone along a border) -- if it means
anything at all.
Another idea struck me: Perhaps you break it into two clauses using the
distance verbs {Hop} "be remote, be far" and {Sum} "be near":
? Daqvam vIleng; cha' qelI'qam Hop.
I went to this place; it was 2 kellicams distant.
? cha' qelI'qam Hopbogh Daq'e' vIleng.
I travelled to a place 2 kellicams away.
Unfortunately neither {Hop} nor {Sum} has been used with a specified
distance, only generally:
Sum Daqmeyvam, tera'ngan
These places are nearby, Terran. CK
Hop jabwI'.
The waiter is far from me right now. (HQ 12/1998)
SoHDaq Sum raS
You are near the table. (HQ 12/1998)
qagh largh SuvwI' ghung. Sum qagh 'e' Sov.
The hungry warrior smells the gagh. He/she knows the gagh is nearby. (HQ
12/1998)
(Okrand discusses the question of deixis in more detail in HolQeD
12/1998:9-10 where he stresses, yet again, that "Context is critical.")
Again, such a simple question - How do we refer to distances? - may need to
be referred to Maltz.
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons