tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Jul 06 09:33:19 2004

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Re: nuq vIjatlh DaneH

Steven Boozer ([email protected]) [KLI Member] 

<[email protected]>:
> >Especially if you turn it around and use the answer as a model.  Then there
> >simply is no question to confuse the issue.  {<tlhaQ ghu'vam> Dajatlh 
> vIneH.}
> >I agree with ghunchu'wI'.  Okrand's statement about QAO was about a 
> completely
> >different type of sentence.  Replacing <tlhaQ ghu'vam> with <nuq> makes
> >perfect sense, and remains a question, asking for an answer.

SuStel:
>Careful!  The trick in *{nuq Dajatlh vIneH} is that the answer cannot be a
>quotation.  There are two ways to say "I want you to say, 'This is a funny
>situation'":
>
>     tlhaQ ghu'vam bIjatlh vIneH
>     bIjatlh tlhaQ ghu'vam vIneH.
>
>With the verbs of saying, {jatlh} and {ja'}, the quotation is simply a
>separate sentence, placed on either side of the sentence with the verb of
>saying.  The quotation is not the object of the verb.

Okrand on the subtleties of {jatlh}:

   From: "Marc Okrand" <[email protected]>
   Newsgroups: msn.onstage.startrek.expert.okrand
   Date: 29 Jun 1997
   Subject: Re: Some quick questions...

       [snip]

   There's another wrinkle to this.  The verb jatlh can also be used when
   giving direct quotations:

       tlhIngan jIH jatlh "he/she says, 'I am a Klingon'"

       jatlh tlhIngan jIH "he/she says, 'I am a Klingon'"

   (With verbs of saying, such as jatlh, the phrase that is being said or
   cited may come before or after the verb.)

   If the speaker is first or second person, the pronominal prefix indicating
   "no object" is used:

       tlhIngan jIH jIjatlh "I say, 'I am a Klingon'"

       tlhIngan jIH bIjatlh "you say, 'I am a Klingon'"

   There are instances where the pronominal prefix marks a big distinction in
   meaning:

       tlhIngan Hol Dajatlh "you speak Klingon"

       tlhIngan Hol bIjatlh "you say, 'Klingon language'" [that is "you say
                             the phrase 'Klingon language'"]


Thus, I stand corrected; my facetious suggestion in the "Re: ghelmeH 
mu'tlhegh'e' Sayu'" thread that

    <<nuq>> vIjatlh DaneH'a'?
    Do you want me to say [the word] "nuq"?

is a possible, though unlikely, translation is wrong.  It has to be:

    <<nuq>> bIjatlh DaneH'a'?
    Do you want me to say [the word] "nuq"?

using the "no object" prefix on {jatlh}.

<ahem>  DopDaq qul yIchenmoH QobDI' ghu'!




-- 
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons

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