tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sat Aug 23 21:50:14 2003

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Re: Grammar Question

Mark E. Shoulson ([email protected]) [KLI Member] [Hol po'wI']

ja' Tad Stauffer:

 >Jeff Sipek wrote:

>> > > Ok, I think I'm trying to read this too deeply. Which one is the popular
>> > > one?
>> > >
>> > > 1) Quch Hab ghaj SoSlI'
>> > > 2) Hab SoSlI' Quch

>>On Saturday 23 August 2003 17:24, ...Paul wrote:
>> > vIqawtaHvIS jIlughchugh...  (If I remember correctly)...
>> >
>> > #1.  "Quch Hab ghaj SoSlI'"

>Actually, in Power Klingon, the insult is given as {Hab SoSlI' Quch}.
>Maybe Okrand felt that "Your mother has a smooth forehead" was a better 
>translation than the literal "Your mother's forehead is smooth", since the 
>Klingon version leaves "forehead" for the final word of the insult.
>Maybe {Quch} is sort of like a punchline, and is what makes this a real zinger:
>Hab SoSlI'... *Quch*!


It also *may* call into question whether or not it's sensible to "have" 
a forehead. "Have" is a notoriously polysemous word in English (you 
"have" a book, a test in Biology on Thursday, and a cold in three very 
different ways, and that's just the first few that came to mind).  
{ghaj} is given as "have, possess", leading me to think it leans closer 
to the "possession" meaning of "have" than others.  One does not 
"possess" one's forehead (you might possess another one, though, say 
mounted on your wall).

This isn't to say that I think it's *wrong* to say {cha' DeS vIghaj} or 
something, but it's something to think about.  I personally think Okrand 
avoided "ghaj" in this case deliberately, perhaps to avoid "possessing" 
a forehead, or perhaps to be more in line with the "verb centric" nature 
of Klingon, that what's important is that the forehead is smooth.  Why 
bring a possibly irrelevant verb into things?

Just a thought.

~mark

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