tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Fri May 01 20:22:26 1998
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states, activities (was Much Ado)
- From: "David Trimboli" <[email protected]>
- Subject: states, activities (was Much Ado)
- Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 14:14:39 -0400
From: Stauffer, Tad E (STAUFTE7) <[email protected]>
> I had a thought about how this use of imperative stative verbs might
>be explained.. In the case of {..yIyoH}, the state can be changed by the
>person spoken to, without any actual physical act. With {petaD} (when
>taken literally), however, a physical process is required. When ordered,
>you can't simply try to become frozen.. you have to do something to
>cause yourself to be frozen, such as jump in a barrel of liquid
>nitrogen. Similarly, I don't think that {yIHegh} could be used properly
>as a command under normal circumstances, since you can't just die at
>will. You would have to do something physical to change to that
>condition.
That's a very compelling thought, Tad, especially since the other example
Okrand uses is with {tuj}, and becoming hot cannot be done without a
physical process.
> So if someone said {yIyoH} (as SuStel quoted above), you can
>presumably become brave just by willing yourself.
Another way of looking at it is that some words, such as {yoH}, can be
*either* stative or active, depending on the current concept being used. In
the case of {wej tlhInganpu' yoH} (CK), the {yoH} is definitely describing a
state: the Klingons are not BEING brave actively, they simply ARE brave, as
a state.
Then, as you point out, "being frozen" is something which you cannot do
actively, you can only attain that state. Therefore, anytime someone
commands you to "be frozen," it can only be viewed as the idiomatic usage.
> The problem, then, becomes "What states can be spontaneously created
>at will, and which require action to achieve them?" i.e., To say "Be
>insubordinate!" would you use {yItlhIv} or {yItlhIv'eghmoH}?
More to the point, how about the original verb which started this: {tuv} "be
patient." Is that something you can actively do, or is it a state only? It
looks like it can be active, according to this criteria you've suggested,
which would make Lawrence's original sentence, {yItuv}, correct.
What a thorny little problem!
SuStel
Stardate 98332.0