tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sat Feb 07 01:26:03 1998
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Re: introduction
ghItlh William H. Martin
> The Klingon {gh} is basically a vocalized {H}. That makes it
> essentially a growl at the back of the throat.
That's exactly the way I pronounce it in normal everyday
conversations in Dutch. Just a nice, smooth "gh". Very smooth. But
when I speak Klingon, I make my "gh" a lot raspier. Very raspy, just
as I hear Okrand do it on the tapes. And if I do that, it tends to
sound (for me) like "ghr".
> > So, what I'm saying is, if I pronounce {ghargh} in a way that I think
> > is correct, I'd be saying somthing like [grargr]. (With an [r] as
> > mentioned above, not an English [r], so it sounds even raspier. I
> > really like Klingon, apart from the pain in my throat ;)
I'm sorry if I confused anyone here with writing "grargr". I didn't
mean an English "g" here, I meant the Dutch one. Maybe I should have
written "ghrarghr".
> This has to be wrong because the {r} sound before {gh} is
> nothing like any part of the {gh} sound. It is much farther
> forward in the mouth. In fact, it is focussed on the opposite
> end of the tongue.
>
> Normally, a Klingon {r} is lightly trilled, like most European
> {r}s. English does not generally do this, unless you are a very
> dramatic Shakespearian actor who doesn't understand the concept
> of "off stage". It is a vocalized sound shaped by the tip of
> the tongue.
>
> Most people modify this when it preceeds the {gh}, pronouncing
> it more like an American "r", because it is simply difficult to
> go from a trilled "r" at the tip of the tongue to the vocalized
> {H} at the back of the throat. It can be done. I do it, when I
> really work at it, but it is not easy. {rgh} happens in my name
> {charghwI'}, so I figured it would be important to know how to
> pronounce it well.
>
> Still, trilled or not, the {r} sound is shaped by the tip of
> the tongue while the {gh} sound is shaped by the back of the
> throat. It is not as deep as the {Q} sound, but it is
> definitely shaped by the throat and not the tongue tip.
>
> So, I don't care HOW you pronunce a Dutch "r", there is no such
> thing as an "r" sound that can exist both in {r} and in {gh}
> such that {ghargh} can be pronounced as "grargr".
Well, still there is...
At least, if you "mispronounce" "r" as I do. :)
For some reason, I always make an "r" in the back of my mouth. I'm
not a linguist, but I believe I do it by trilling my... erm... wha't
it called... well, you know, that hanging blob at the back of the
mouth you always see in cartoons when sombody's yelling. I trill that
against the back of my tongue, I think. I think this is the wrong "r"
pronounciation Chakotay mentioned. I have tried once to trill with
my tongue to make an "r" sound, but I somehow couldn't. And neither
can most people I know (at least they don't). And still it *sounds*
like a trilling "r".
But from this "wrong" "r", it isn't difficult to go to a "gh" at all.
>
> > (Amazing, all those discussions just about *one* letter in the
> > alphabet... :)
>
> Without it, my name becomes {charwI'}. I don't respond well to
> that.
>
> > > Chakotay
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > /Doneq
> > ______
> > yIvoq 'ach yI'ol
> >
>
> charghghghghghghghghghgwI'
>
>
/Doneq
______
yIvoq 'ach yI'ol