tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu Jun 27 15:18:11 1996
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Re: Verb quantification: KLBC
- From: Will Martin <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: Verb quantification: KLBC
- Date: Thu, 27 Jun 1996 18:18:00 -0400 ()
- Priority: NORMAL
On Wed, 26 Jun 1996 22:26:44 -0700 [email protected]
wrote:
> Second post: I am trying to find out how to ask questions which quantify
> verbal action. Perhaps I will need to know how to answer such questions,
> also.
>
> chay' tIQ bIQtIQvam
> chay' jen loDvetlh
> chay' 'ugh luchchaj
Pardon me as I choose to respond, since this doesn't really
feel like KLBC, since it is something for which we
basically don't have an authoritative answer. I do believe
that {chay'} is wrong, since all canon uses it only
adverbially modifying verbs, not nouns, as in {chay'
jura'?}. I think you want {'ar} as the question word, but
we are not quite sure how to use it.
My guess would be:
qelI'qam 'ar ghaj bIQtIQvam?
qelI'qam 'ar 'oH bIQtIQvam?
qelI'qam 'ar tIQ bIQtIQvam?
We can use qelI'qammey to measure things on the scale of a
river, but do we say that the river *possesses* kelicams?
Or do we say that a river IS a certain number of kelicams?
Or do we use kelicams as one of those nouns which is
neither subject nor object and comes at the beginning of a
sentence, in this example explaining something about the
river being long? I like this last version, though I had
never considered it before. I think it is my favorite.
The only way I would be certain would be to have Okrand
give us an example of use of units of measure in a complete
sentence. How do we USE this unit of measure in a sentence?
In canon, it was simply a unit called out as two ships grew
closer.
jIH jen law' loDvetlh jen puS, qar'a'?
We have no unit of measure for something on the scale of a
man, so there is no quantitative way for us, as yet, to
ANSWER such a question as "How many Xs tall is that man?"
Formulating a quantitative question we lack the tools to
answer is the kind of rhetorical question Klingons are not
known to entertain.
'ugh'a' luchchaj?
We have no units of weight measurement as yet. Besides,
since Klingons don't tend to admire complaints, it tends to
be enough to know if something is heavy or not or if it is
VERY heavy. Finer degrees of accuracy may be considered
culturally insignificant.
I know that Klingons may be inaccurate, but they are never
approximate, but in terms of weight, since it seems
insignificant enough to not even bother giving us a unit of
measure for it, this may not be considered something one
measures. When humans talk about something being clean or
bright or soft or orange or bouncy or wobbly or translucent
or rough or sharp or convex... do they have a unit of
measure for these things? No.
Instead, they just note extreme degrees or they compare
objects. Perhaps the same could be said of a man's height.
Anything less than a kelicam in length apparently is not
considered worth measuring.
Why measure something you can touch? Use the object itself
as a unit of measure. Carpenters can either measure, or
they can mark their work, needing no measurement.
Meanwhile, kelicams measure how long it takes to get
somewhere if you are attacking it, or whether or not a
power weapon has enough range to reach a target. THAT has
social significance.
> peHruS
charghwI'