tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Mar 07 06:36:39 1995
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Re: KBLC: lutmey: 'ay' wa'DIch
- From: "William H. Martin" <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: KBLC: lutmey: 'ay' wa'DIch
- Date: Tue, 7 Mar 95 9:36:36 EST
- In-Reply-To: <[email protected]>; from "Silauren, Half-Elven" at Mar 6, 95 4:53 pm
Given ~mark's announcement that he will neither be available
for quick response for a week, nor will he decide on a BG to
fill the void, I will hereby violate all protocol and declare
myself interim acting BG. If anyone has a problem with this, I
welcome you to replace me. I will gladly stand aside.
According to Silauren, Half-Elven:
>
>
> lutmey: 'ay' wa'DIch
> --------------------
> batlhmaj lutmey bIH ghItlhpu'vam.
This is not a sentence. There is no verb. If {bIH} were being
used as a verb, then the word following it would have to be a
noun with the {-'e'} suffix. Meanwhile, {ghItlhpu'vam} is a
very confused word.
It begins with a root that can be either a noun or a verb (but
not both at the same time). The suffix {-pu'} can also be used
on both nouns and verbs, but as a noun suffix, the noun needs
to be capable of language. I don't think manuscripts qualify
under this category, so it must be the perfective verb suffix,
but then we run into {-vam} which is ONLY a noun suffix.
So we cascade backwards and reinterpret the {-pu'} and realize
that the author has clearly made multiple mistakes here; too
many mistakes for us to make anything out of this mu'thleghqoq.
You cannot have both verb and noun suffixes attached to the
same word unless these two classes of suffixes are separated by
a nominalizer, like {-ghach}, or less likely {-wI'}.
Our honor's stories' their these interactively speaking
manuscripts.?? It REALLY helps to include English translations
with your submissions under the banner of KLBC.
> lutmey munobta' vavwI'. vavwI'vaD
> lutmey nobta' vavnI'wI'. tIghmaj 'oH. vaj DaH lutmey qanoblI'.
These are clearly spoken.
> lutmey
> munobDI' quppu'wI', batlh Qu'mey munobta' je quppu'wI'.
This is a little ambiguous, though that's not your fault. My
interpretation is that it means, "When my elders give me
stories, they also have accomplished honorably giving me
tasks." If you instead meant that they have you tasks of honor,
you might choose {quv} instead of {batlh} just to be clear that
you mean the noun and not the adverbial.
I do question the use of {-ta'} here, since one presumes that
the giving of the story and the giving of the task is
simultaneous. As you state it, when the giving of the story
happens, the giving of the task has already finished happening.
It feels like the giving of the task happens first, since it is
complete while the giving of the story is happening.
> not rIn
> Qu'meyvam. tIghmaj 'oH. Qu'mey tIghmaj je Dayaj 'e' luchaw'jaj lutmeyvam.
All of this is stated clearly, though {chaw'} is perhaps a weak
verb here. You probably want something closer to {tungHa'}.
> --naQ'avwI'
charghwI'
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