tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Tue Feb 07 15:10:10 1995
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
Re: *Esquire magazine*Daq tlhIngan Hol vIlaD!
>Date: Mon, 6 Feb 1995 17:35:12 -0500
>Originator: [email protected]
>From: "William H. Martin" <[email protected]>
>According to Silauren, Half-Elven:
>..
>> "toH qo' muSHa'qu'mo joH'a', wa' puqloDDaj nobpu' ghaH 'ej ghaH
>> Harchugh vay', vaj not Hegh ghaH, 'ach yIn jub ghajbej ghaH.""
>>
>>
>> ....just a little blurb, but i thought i'd pass it on... btw, any typos
>> in the Klingon above is Esquire's fault, not mine (its exactly as Esquire
>> printed it, minus their formatting...)
>No typos that I can see. In fact, it is so clearly written I
>could sight read it, only needing to look up {jub}, since I
>don't use that word very often. For the curious, it means, "So
>because the Lord (joH'a') very much loved the world, he had
>given his one son, and if anybody believed him, then he will
>never die, but he will definitely possess immortal life."
>I think the perfective is a mistake here, once again used to
>represent what was intended as a common past tense, and I think
>it would be better to say {puqloDDaj neH nob ghaH}, since {wa'
>puqloDDaj} could easily mean "one of his sons" instead of "his
>only son". I also think this is an expansion of the verb {Har},
>since the Christian use of the verb "believe" is rather
>strange. I think the original is something like, "and whosoever
>believes in him" and I defy ANYBODY to explain what that means
>in plain, secular English. As a verb, it is mystical and
>symbolic, having little to do with the normal meanings of the
>verb "believe".
I have a *strong* suspicion that this verse was translated by none other
than Glen Proechel. It's exactly the kind of thing he'd translate first,
and I know he was working on John before anyone else was. Notably, Glen
seems to differ a bit on the perfectives, and does tend to use them as past
tense (claiming that the action is complete). You know how Glen is.
As to "believe", it's not so much the difference between normal belief and
religious belief, but more like difference between "believing X" and
"believing in X". "Believing X" means believing that X occured (if X is an
event) or in things that X says (if X is a person or book or something).
"Believing in X" means believing that X exists (if X is a concept) or
trusting X in some way (if X is a person). The concept of "believing in
Jesus" here sounds to me like possibly both of the "Believing in X"
meanings. We have no other word for "believe", and we don't know how
Klingon semantics differ from English ones. It's probably a good bet that
they don't use the prepositions quite so much... I dunno, I can't think of
a better word. Maybe I can. "voq"?
>charghwI'
~mark