tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sun May 23 00:11:28 2004

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Re: paghHu'/paghleS

QeS lagh ([email protected]) 

ghItlhpu' lay'tel SIvten:

>TKD states that {pagh} is a numeral when it means 'zero'.

True... However, {paghDIch} is written up in KGT under the section heading 
"Intentional Ungrammaticality" IIRC. As a result, it can be seen that {pagh} 
isn't quite the same as all the other numbers.

As I said earlier, I think {pagh} is a recent development, and {pagh} the 
numeral and {pagh} the noun have not completely disassociated themselves 
from each other yet.

taH:
>Everybody seems agreed that the 'day' words mean "today".  Words with {Hu'} 
>can't have a future meaning, and words with {leS} can't have a past 
>meaning.  Put the two together and you have words like {paghHu'} and 
>{paghleS}.  Whether I say that's what they mean or not, that IS what they 
>mean.  Okrand has given us the words AND the grammar, and this is the 
>result.

ehhhmmm... thin reasoning, methinks. You say earlier (and I quote):

"I gave it a novel meaning because the obvious meaning ("today") is already 
well filled by at least two other words."

But if it's filled by two other words, why can't we have more? Based on your 
reasoning, we could make a case for dispensing with {jajvam}, because 
there's already a meaning for the word "today": {DaHjaj}. So, if the space 
is filled already, {jajvam} must mean something slightly different. But this 
is not so. Look at {baHwI'} and {matHa'}. Look at {yeq} and {jIj}. What's 
wrong with synonymy?

In response to your statement "If you don't like it, don't use it.": That's 
all well and good, but if you use a word, it's expected that the other 
person *also* knows what it means. We're supposed to be *communicating* 
here.

Savan.

QeS lagh

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