tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sat Jun 17 03:31:45 2000
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
Re: Thinking the sentence structure
From: David Trimboli <[email protected]>
> jatlh qe'San:
>
> The "concept" I'll extend is the "get over it" concept.
Understood.
> We need to get over
> the desire for exacting procedures and just go with it.
The problem is I didn't until I got involved in the list and once you start
looking for whats wrong with something you're going to find it.. and if you
don't someones bound to tell you.. Don't get me wrong, I'm not really
complaining. If I was I'd just stop using the list but it's taught me too
much for that.
> I think that the
> scope of rovers can vary depending on what the speaker is talking about,
but
> more importantly, I see little reason anymore in trying to restrict its
> usage.
Yes Its important to know what is right or wrong but in cases where it's
just not known it should be allowed to just communicate..ie if you
understand what is being said then surely it has worked.. Obviouslly any
incorect usage should be highlighted but if a particular usage is not To
indicate that something is wrong is correct
>
> > The most frustrating thing I find is when you ask if a sentence is ok
> and/or
> > could it be improved. Sometimes you can get replies telling all the
> various
> > reasons why it isn't but not get any assistance on how to correct it.
>
> That depends on many things. In the past I've noticed that I tend to end
> things with how *I* would do it, but I also spend a great deal of time
> typing in a full explanation of whatever it is. Other experts on the list
> often prefer the "I'll give you a hint; let's see if you get it" method.
> I don't like this as much because the person
> may NOT get it, and it can seem awfully patronizing.
This may seem like a cop out but I like both depending on the problem.. What
I would say however is, if someone really wasn't interested in learning
anything from the valuable time spent answering queries on the mailing list
then they wouldn't bother reading your explanation of your suggestion and if
they had wanted to learn they would try to work out for themsleves why your
suggestion worked better. However as long as replies say, "what about trying
......" then at least beginners can go away and try it if some reply,
"that's wrong" or "that doesn't work" etc but offer no guidance for the
student then there is a chance that they will give up.. It may just be a
question of time before that student walks away from tlhIngan Hol.
> >
> On the other hand, I've seen people demand the unreasonable. When I was
> Beginners' Grammarian, I often had to stop and tell someone that they were
> simply demanding too much of my time. "You're trying to do too much," I
> would say. "Simplify." If it was that much work for me, chances are that
> correcting everything wasn't the solution anyway.
Yes I've seen many good reponse to that sort of problem. Although I've been
away from the list for a while I remember Qov setting lessons/exercises for
someone when they hadn't grasped basics. Maybe something like that could be
added to the FAQ. This would obviously take time but in the long term it
may save a lot of time especially for beginners Grammarian's. Just a
thought.
>
> And sometimes, the answer really is just "maybe." Sometimes we don't know
> for sure. Sometimes one may ask a question which is very controversial
> around here, and which has been hotly debated before.
Sorry and I was guilty of linking back to an old arguement but I hadn't done
it on purpose to get on anyones nerves. I was just pointing out that if an
idea being proposed was accepted that it might impact or raise new points
re: a previous argument. This in itself might help to decide the validity
of the suggestion or in fact bring new light to the old arguement.
>And sometimes (often)
> people who are trying to help go off on amazing tangents, leaving the
> original questioner in the dust.
>
> KLBC is a good idea, and KLIC isn't too bad (though I won't be using it
> myself). I've often thought we need a KLQA, which could be thought of as
> "Klingon Language Quick Answers" or "Klingon Language Question and
Answer,"
> which is not governed by a Grammarian, but in which tangents are not
> allowed. Just answer the question. I don't expect to see this, however.
>
There is always [email protected] for those just wanting a straight answer to
question like, " I want to say........." please could you translate it for
me? (full details of offer from Lawrence below in case anyone wasn't aware
of it as there isn't a mention of it on the FAQ. Perhaps the offer was
limited??)
>
> SuStel
> Stardate 458.8
Qapla'
qe'San
>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Attached message mentioned above:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>From the KLI:
>>Maybe you want to have a set of helpful phrases you can use when
working security at a local con. Perhaps you want to be able to present a
toast
at the next Klingon Feast. Are Federation types mocking you with Klingon
insults that you don't understand? Or could it be that your own junior
officers are challenging you to curse warfare? Let us help.
All you have to do is let us know what you want. As requests for
different categories of Klingon expressions come in, we'll prepare more PDF
documents and post them to the KLI's website. You'll be able to download
them for
free, print them up, and pass them out at your next meeting,
incorporating them as you see fit.
Why are we doing this? Because it's who we are and what we do. We see
it as a win/win situation: More fans get to learn the bits and pieces of
the
warriors' tongue that they specificly want, and more people will be
using Klingon which is what we want. It's that simple. There're no catches,
no hidden agendas.
Now, the last part, but the most important! Send your request lists to
us by writing to:
[email protected]
Put the word REQUEST in the subject line. We'll handle it from there.
taHjaj wo',
Lawrence M. Schoen, Ph.D.
KLI Director >>