In a message dated 2/19/1999 6:53:12 AM US Mountain Standard Time, [email protected] writes: << Have I helped you on to square two now? >> ghobe' Now you are wrong regarding {Hoch}, too. {Hoch} refers to "all" the elements of a set. {HochHom} refers to "some" of the elements of a set. {naQ} refers to "all" of any one element (entity). peHruS