tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Fri Mar 14 20:58:29 1997
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next]
RE: KLBC:puch pa'
- From: "David Trimboli" <[email protected]>
- Subject: RE: KLBC:puch pa'
- Date: Sat, 15 Mar 97 04:54:13 UT
jatlh jeyD:
> I like my red glass and my ugly book
>
> HIvje'wij Doqbogh paqwij moHbogh je vIparHa'
> I am unsure about the use of je and the verb prfixes
Don't forget the capital {I}s in the suffix {-wIj}!
Take a look at TKD 4.4. It explains how you can use stative verbs as
adjectives: by placing them immediately after the noun they describe. You
don't need to use {-bogh} (and you've used it incorrectly, anyway).
HIvje'wIj Doq paqwIj moH je vIparHa'.
You *can* use {-bogh} to do this sort of thing if you want. Look over TKD
6.2.3 on relative clauses.
If we wanted to say "the book is red," you'd say {Doq paq}. The subject comes
last. If you wanted to use the relative clause "the book which is red," the
order of this phrase doesn't change. {paq} is still the subject. Only now,
you add the {-bogh} suffix. {Doqbogh paq}
So, if you wanted to use {-bogh} for some reason, it'd be
Doqbogh HIvje'wIj moHbogh paqwIj je vIparHa'.
> (this is the) bath room. If you make a mess and don't clean it up then I
> will kill you.
>
> puch pa'Daq. puch pa' DaghIHmoHchugh 'ej puch pa' Dasay'be' vaj qaHoH.
Okay. First remember that in both English and in Klingon "bathroom" {puchpa'}
is one room.
Your first sentence simply says "In/at the bathroom." This is not a complete
sentence. I'm imagining someone pointing out the bathroom and saying this
sentence. So, let's make it complete for Klingon.
puchpa' 'oH pa'vam'e'.
This room is the bathroom.
You may need to study TKD 6.3 to understand how I used the pronoun here.
Next you have {puch pa' DaghIHmoHchugh} for "If you make a mess." Except for
the split word {puchpa'} (actually, it would come out the same in speech),
this is a good subordinate clause. However, the second subordinate is missing
its {-chugh}.
You said "and don't clean it up." You're using the "if" from before, but in
Klingon you need to repeat {-chugh}. You can't say "If you make a mess and
you do not clean it up." You have to say "If you make a mess and if you do
not clean it up."
Also, {Say'} (with a capital {S}) means "be clean," not "clean (something)."
To say that, you need to use {-moH}: {Say'moH} "cause (something) to be
clean."
puchpa' DaghIHmoHchugh 'ej puchpa' DaSay'moHbe'chugh vaj qaHoH
If you make the bathroom messy and you don't clean the bathroom up, then I'll
kill you.
You might want to leave out the second instance of {puchpa'} here. We know
what you're talking about, so you're allowed to just leave it out. The verb
prefix {Da-} lets us know what you mean.
puchpa' DaghIHmoHchugh 'ej DaSay'moHbe'chugh vaj qaHoH.
If you make the bathroom messy and you don't clean it up, then I'll kill you.
> Also I am having difficulty understand how the verb previxes work.
> when you say <I eat the food> does the prfix on eat refer to the food as
> <it> or <none>.
Since "food" is an "it," and not "I" or "you," but a third-person singular
noun, you use the object prefix for "it." "I" subject and "it" object is the
verb prefix {vI-}.
> And when you refer ro a place like as in I am going < > is the
> place referd to as <it> or <none>.
If you're talking about using Type 5 Noun Suffixes like {-Daq}, then the
answer is that those nouns are not subjects or objects.
qagh vISop.
I eat gagh.
Qe'Daq qagh vISop.
I eat gagh in a restaurant.
{Qe'Daq} is not an subject or an object. Call it "oblique" if you like, but
it's just a word which indicates where the action is taking place or directed
towards.
qalegh.
I see you.
pa'lIjDaq qalegh.
I see you in your room.
The subject is "I" {jIH} (though it's been omitted) and the object is "you"
{SoH} (also omitted). {pa'lIjDaq} is neither subject nor object.
This could also be written as
pa'lIjDaq SoH qalegh jIH.
> One last thing when you say I like the red book the order is < book red
> like I > what does red and like take
> on as a prefix.
You've got the right prefixes above. They follow the same rules as everything
else. Adjectivally acting verbs don't get prefixes, of course; you can't put
a prefix on the verb in {paq Doq} "the red book." But anything else will get
a prefix according to its subject and object.
paq vIparHa'bogh Dalegh.
You see the book which I like.
The main verb is {Dalegh} "you" subject, "it" object. The "it" is "the book
which I like." This is an "it," right? So, that's why I used the prefix
{Da-}.
paq vIparHa'bogh
the book which I like
This is the noun phrase I used. "I" am doing the liking, so "I" am the
subject. The book is an "it," so I use subject "I" object "it": {vI-}.
> Thank you so much for your help.
qay'be'.
--
SuStel
Beginners' Grammarian
Stardate 97202.5