tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Wed Sep 04 21:57:05 1996

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Re: KLBC: Thinking and compounding

At 09:18 AM 8/30/96 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
><Thinking>
>
>jIH jIQubmoHbogh


I really, truely hate that "to be" structure ate times, because it gets so
abused...

I really don't think you can use <jIH> to mean "to exist" like this.  This
has been debated on the list, but I *think* the consensus is that the "to
be" structure where pronouns are used to mean "to be" can ONLY be used with
another noun.  You don't have another noun in here, anwhere... I would read
this as "I who I cause to think", which isn't even correct, because you
would best use -'egh inthat situation.  I don't think this is grammatically
correct, nor do I believe you have said anything intelligible here.


>jIQub jIHmoHtaHbogh


Same problem here... I don't think you can use <jIH> this way.  Any time you
feel tempted to use a pronoun like this, I would recommend that you re-cast.


>SKI: I think which causes me to be


This sounds suspiciously like "I think therefore I am".

I would actaully use -ghagh in here:

        muyInmoH QubtaHghaghwIj.
        "My thinking causes me to live."

Actaully, I am not really happy with THAT translation, either.  I think what
you really need to do, is go back to your original thought, and re-word it
without the verb "to be" in it.

What IS really wierd IS about the time I WAS getting pretty good at tlhIngan
Hol, I had to take some writing classes in school.  One of the first thing
my English teacher did WAS detail to us the follicies of the verb "to be".
It IS the most common verb in the English language, and often IS the first
one many of us learn.  It also happens TO BE the most *boring*.  If you use
"to be" in all your sentence, they will BE rather tedious.  True, they will
BE very discriptive, but your audience will BE bored.

I think that was a really boring paragraph.  Let's re-word it:

Oddly enough, about the time I became skilled at speaking tlhIngan Hol, I
needed to take some writing classes in school.  My English teacher promptly
detailed to us the follicies of the verb "to be".  While commonly found in
English, and many of us learn it first, it bores people.  It will BE very
tedious, if people read "to be" in every sentence you write.  You will
describe things clearly, but you will bore your audience.

Amazing what a little re-casing does, isn't it?  Nine uses dropped down to one.

Try this approach whenever you feel tempted to say "to be" with those pronouns.


>SKI: I am which causes me to think


Same comments as above.

I hesitate to offer any re-casts for this, because I really am not sure what
you are trying to say.  Are you trying to be philosophical, or something?


><compounding>
>
>jIH mubej tinloDnI'


Ahh... much better!  MUCH better!

This is a nice, simple sentence, with only a few (small) problems.

The first is that you didn't capItalIze your "I" in <tIn>.  The second is
that you have put <tIn> in front of your noun, and attempted to compound it
with the noun.  We can't do that... as far as we know, we can only use NOUNS
to combine into newnouns.  <tIn> is a verb.  Fortunately, we DO have a way
we can use verbs to modify a noun (several of them, in fact!).  In your
English sentence, you used "big" as an adjective... well, some verbs can be
used as adjectives in klingon, too!  Even better, the verb you picked just
happens to be one.. Adjectives are described on pages 49 and 50 of your KD.
To use a verb as an adjective, just put it after the noun:

        jIH mubej loDnI' tIn

The only other thing I would do is change your *choice* of verb.  I suspect
that the expression "Big brither" has some idiomatic meanings, and that you
are using one here.  If you simply mean "My brother is really large, and he
is watching me", that's fine.  If you mean "big brother" as in a brother who
may not be physically bigger than you, but is older and protects you... then
you may need to pick another verb.  Unfortunately, you may also not be able
to ue it as an adjective if you do...

Or you could just use <quploDnI'> (<loDnI'qup>?), which IS a valid noun-noun
construction, and would probably convey this meaning.


>may'yolthDaq Hegh qupSuvwI'


I don't see anything wrong with this off-hand... on the other hand, it is
well past my bed-time.  It looks kinda funny, but it may just be seeing two
compound-nouns in one sentence or something.

Overall, I think this last sentence was your best one (grammatically) in
this whole post.  See?  You get better as you go on! {{;)


>SKI: Big brother watches me


Oh, please note that the verb you used <bej> may only mean "to watch" as in,
"to observe"; it may or may not contain the connotation of "watch (over)",
as in "to protect".  For that meaning, you would have to go with <Qan>.


>SKI: The elder warrior dies on the battle field
>
>Qapla'


*sighs, as her rather battered KD finish splitting down the middle in her
hand.  wejpuH.  She now has four half-dictionaries, bit no whole ones...*

I need to get to a bookstore, huh?  {{:/


>beHwI"av


--tQ


---
HoD trI'Qal, tlhIngan wo' Duj lIy So' ra'wI'
Captain T'rkal, Commander IKV Hidden Comet
Klingon speaker and net junkie!
HaghtaHbogh tlhIngan yIvoqQo'!  toH... qatlh HaghtaH Qanqor HoD???
monlI'bogh tlhInganbe' yIvoqQo'!  SoHvaD monlI' trI'Qal...

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