tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Oct 12 07:14:33 2015
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Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Noun sequences
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Courier">I haven’t found any examples of “A son/daughter of B, son/daughter of C”, but I did find this explanation by Okrand which may be useful:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Courier"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Courier">(st.k 9/1997): If you want to be even more formal, the name of the father may be used as well... "Kahlor, son of Kahlin, of the House of Molor" is "Kahlor, son of Kahlin, House of Molor" {<b>qeylor qeylIn
puqloD molor tuq}</b>.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Courier"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A">Yet another possibility – and it’s only a possibility, as we’ve never seen any examples of this extended type of name – is to use {</span><b><span style="font-family:Courier">puqnI'loD/puqnI’be’}</span></b><span style="font-family:Courier">
“grandson/granddaughter”. E.g.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A"> ? A B puqloD, C puqnI’loD A son of B, grandson of C (?)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A">The “A son of B of the House of C” seems to be the usual pattern for extended names. Perhaps Klingons view one’s father and House (or “tribe”) as much more important than one’s grandfather
{vavnI’} (which has never been used by Okrand in a Klingon sentence AFAIK).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">--<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Voragh<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Ca'Non Master of the Klingons<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#44546A"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Robyn Stewart [mailto:[email protected]]
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<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, October 11, 2015 11:16 AM<br>
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<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">We know {Bob, John puqloD} works.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">In English “Bob, son of John, son of Fred...” may work just because each phrase sets up the new name at the end, to be in apposition with the next
“son of...” phrase. Perhaps Voragh the canon master will spot this and enlighten us about whether the Klingon grammar of extended genealogy has ever been used in an episode or paq’batlh. To make it clear, I might say Bob, John puqloD, Fred puqnI’loD je, but
that’s not extensible through more generations.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"> Anthony Appleyard [<a href="mailto:[email protected]";>mailto:[email protected]</a>]
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<b>Sent:</b> October 11, 2015 6:39<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:[email protected]";>[email protected]</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Tlhingan-hol] Noun sequences<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-CA"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-CA">If any sequence of nouns "A B" means "B of A", how to say e.g. "A son of B son of C"? I have been using "A B puqloD C puqloD". Or does that always mean "son of C of son of B of A"? Or what?
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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