tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Thu Jul 10 14:03:11 2003
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Re: yu' jIghaj...
SuStel:
> > I don't believe that /romuluSngan Hol/ is attested anywhere in canon.
> > I see nothing wrong with constructing the phrases with ANY appropriate
> > genitive noun; your choice of noun will alter your meaning.
SuStel is right. *{romuluSngan Hol} is not attested anywhere. Go figure.
> > If I say /romuluS Hol/, I'm saying "the language(s) of Romulus." If I say
> > /romuluSngan Hol/, I'm saying "the language(s) of Romulans." What if
> there
> > are non-Romulan beings that live on Romulus, and have their own language?
> > By choosing the appropriate terms, you can change your meaning.
> >
> > The phrase /tlhIngan Hol/ is used to refer to a specific language (and its
> > dialects), though it also means "language(s) of Klingons." Since
> Okrand has
> > provided concrete evidence of this, we can accept it as true. Aside from
> > this and /DIvI' Hol/, I'm not sure what we can surmise about language
> names
> > apart from what the rules tell us. /tlhIngan Hol/ and /DIvI' Hol/ are
> used
> > as proper nouns; I don't think we have any any other language names
> that are.
For years I've been annoyed at seeing forms like {*German* Hol} or
{*Germany* Hol} having convinced myself that the "correct" forms should be
the awkward {*Germany*ngan Hol} based on what I assumed were the
Okrandian examples {tlhIngan Hol}, {romuluSngan Hol} and {vulqangan
Hol}. It turns out that the last two are not, in fact, canonical;
furthermore, we don't even know the official etymology of {tlhIngan} - it
*appears* to be derived from *{tlhIngngan} "inhabitant of Kling (District?)
- let alone why the language and people are called {tlhIngan} and not
*{Qo'noSngan}. (I mean Okrand's explanation in his role as Federation
linguist. I know why IRL Paramount chose Kronos over Kling for the name of
the planet.) So I'm forced to withdraw my objection to {*German(y)* Hol}
et al.
> > Heck, I see nothing wrong with /ghop Hol/ "hand langauge" to refer to a
> > gesturing language. Keep in mind we're not talking about a proper noun
> > here.
Looks good to me and right in line with the following...
DloraH:
>Other than tlhIngan Hol, the only canon I found is:
>
> Do you speak Federation Standard?
> DIvI' Hol Dajatlh'a'
>
> no' Hol
>
> ta' Hol
{puq Hol} "baby talk" (KGT p. 32)
{ta' tlhIngan Hol} "the Emperor's Klingon" (the fuller form of {ta' Hol}
from KGT p. 14f.)
--
Voragh
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons