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Re: tlhIngan-Hol Digest 8 Apr 2002 05:00:00 -0000 Issue 2178

Unsubscribe me, please. Though I like it, I can't read the Klingon parts.
----- Original Message -----
From: <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 10:00 PM
Subject: tlhIngan-Hol Digest 8 Apr 2002 05:00:00 -0000 Issue 2178


> tlhIngan-Hol Digest 8 Apr 2002 05:00:00 -0000 Issue 2178
>
> Topics (messages 14036 through 14058):
>
> Klingon WOTD: qal (v)
> 14036 by: [email protected]
>
> To follow: the {to' nech}, /Lateral Tactics/ AKA /Oblique Strategies/
> 14037 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> to' nech, 000: Introduction
> 14038 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> to' nech, 001: {Hal latlh yIyu', lI'mo' pagh lI'be'mo'}
> 14039 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> to' nech, 002: {QIt yIqeqlI', vaj nom yIHoH!}
> 14040 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> 14055 by: [email protected]
> 14058 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> to' nech, 003: {mu' puS tIlo'!}
> 14041 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> to' nech, 005: {nejlu'pu', Samlu'pu'}
> 14042 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> to' nech, 004: {ghorghvaD 'oH?}
> 14043 by: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
>
> could somebody check this translation for me?
> 14044 by: DOOM_er <[email protected]>
> 14048 by: "Agnieszka Solska" <[email protected]>
> 14051 by: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> 14052 by: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> 14056 by: Alan Anderson <[email protected]>
>
> yaS wa'DIch jIH
> 14045 by: Qov <[email protected]>
> 14047 by: Alan Anderson <[email protected]>
>
> "be'be'" - double negation
> 14046 by: [email protected]
>
> Sep
> 14049 by: [email protected] (Kyle Rytting)
> 14050 by: [email protected] (Kyle Rytting)
> 14053 by: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
>
> (was: RE: Sep)
> 14054 by: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> 14057 by: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
>
> Administrivia:
>
> To subscribe to the digest, e-mail:
> [email protected]
>
> To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail:
> [email protected]
>
> To post to the list, e-mail:
> [email protected]
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Date: 7 Apr 2002 10:00:02 -0000
> To: [email protected]
> From: [email protected]
> Cc: [email protected];, [email protected]
> Subject: Klingon WOTD: qal (v)
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
>
> This is the Klingon Word Of The Day for Sunday, April 7, 2002.
>
> Klingon word:   qal
> Part of Speech: verb
> Definition:     be corrupt
>
> The Klingon Word Of The Day is brought to you by Holtej
([email protected]).  Please contact me with additions, corrections or
comments.
>
> --Holtej 'utlh
> tlhIngan Hol Mailing List FAQ
> http://www.bigfoot.com/~dspeers/klingon/faq.htm
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 06:18:58 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: To follow: the {to' nech}, /Lateral Tactics/ AKA /Oblique
>   Strategies/
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> I have drafted a restoration of the {to' nech} to the original Klingon,
but
> I fear that there might be an occasional mistake in my text.  So I am
> posting the text of each entry to the list, about five a day.  Each entry
> will have a different Subject: line, so that threads can be
> followed.  (List-readers who want to ignore them all, should just ignore
> anything with "to' nech" in the subject.)
>
> I welcome your suggestions on each entry!
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 06:20:32 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: to' nech, 000: Introduction
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> The To'nech: The Lateral Tactics.
> The restored Klingon Edition.
> Public draft 1.0
>
> Introduction
>
> Any student of Klingon literature of the Platinum Age is, of course,
> familiar with the To'nech {to' nech}, or /Lateral Tactics/.  In fact,
there
> have been so many versions and reorderings and commentaries of it over the
> years, that the reader must wonder what more can be done. But know that
the
> present edition is unique in several respects:
>
> Firstly, this is the first edition that is based on the oldest extant copy
> of the To'nech, found at the MaQvungDoy excavation.  Therefore, this is
> clearly the authoritative edition.  This is in spite of the fact that some
> of the MaQvungDoy To'nech inscriptions were greatly corroded, such that
> they were quite difficult to read.
>
> Secondly, this is the first edition to include a complete translation into
> Federation Standard, accompanying the Klingon original.  This should prove
> useful to readers in the many worlds currently under the heel of the
> Federation, where they are still compelled to favor learning Federation
> rather than Klingon.  Until now, those readers have had to tolerate the
> confused monolingual Standard edition, called /Oblique Strategies/,
> erroneously attributed to the medieval Terrans, Eno and Schmit.  The
> current edition contains the /Oblique Strategies/ text for each entry
> ({Dup}), as it is occasionally of historical interest.
>
> We hope that this edition will introduce many readers to the bold will of
> the To'nech's author, Ingor {'engghor}, the tactician whose strategies
> enabled Ruk'evet ({ruq'e'vet}) to destroy their every adversary.  While
> reliable legend tells little about Ingor besides her authorship of the
> To'nech and its use to Ruk'evet, all who know the To'nech are sure that it
> perfectly reveals the author's great spirit: fiery, commanding, mocking,
> concise, and stern.  Most {Dup} are her commands, others are her
questions,
> and some are her taunts.  May we be honed by them all!
>
>          / qaDwI' Qung // ghevchoqDaq to' 'ampaS /
>          [Proctor Kroong, Tactics Academy at Gevchok]
>
> [translator: S. M. Burke]
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 06:21:06 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: to' nech, 001: {Hal latlh yIyu', lI'mo' pagh lI'be'mo'}
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> K: Hal latlh yIyu', lI'mo' pagh lI'be'mo'.
>
> Gloss: Interrogate another source; because this is useful, or not.
>
> Eno/Schmidt: Consult other sources -promising -unpromising
>
> [The first line is the restored Klingon, the second my English gloss of
the
> Klingon, and the third line is the Eno/Schmidt "Oblique Strategies"
version.]
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 06:23:34 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: to' nech, 002: {QIt yIqeqlI', vaj nom yIHoH!}
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> K: QIt yIqeqlI', 'ej nom yIHoH!
>
> Gloss: Prepare slowly, then execute him quickly!
>
> Eno/Schmidt: Slow preparation, fast execution
>
> [The first line is the restored Klingon, the second my English gloss of
the
> Klingon, and the third line is the Eno/Schmidt "Oblique Strategies"
version.]
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:44:36 EDT
> To: [email protected]
> From: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: to' nech, 002: {QIt yIqeqlI', vaj nom yIHoH!}
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
>
> --part1_a.1cffe852.29e241f4_boundary
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> Sean M. Burke wrote:
> >K: QIt yIqeqlI', 'ej nom yIHoH!
> >
> >Gloss: Prepare slowly, then execute him quickly!
> >
> >Eno/Schmidt: Slow preparation, fast execution
>
> I believe Eno and Schmidt meant "fast execution" in the sense of doing
> something (anything) quickly, not in the sense of killing someone quickly.
> Of course, {HoH} could be used for this meaning in a metaphorical sense.
>
> -Sengval
>
> --part1_a.1cffe852.29e241f4_boundary--
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 21:02:37 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: to' nech, 002: {QIt yIqeqlI', vaj nom yIHoH!}
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> At 20:44 2002-04-07 -0400, [email protected] wrote:
> >Sean M. Burke wrote:
> > >K: QIt yIqeqlI', 'ej nom yIHoH!
> > >Gloss: Prepare slowly, then execute him quickly!
> > >Eno/Schmidt: Slow preparation, fast execution
> >I believe Eno and Schmidt meant "fast execution" in the sense of doing
> >something (anything) quickly, not in the sense of killing someone
quickly.
>
> Ya don't say!
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 06:22:36 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: to' nech, 003: {mu' puS tIlo'!}
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> K:  mu' puS tIlo'!
>
> Gloss: Use few words.
>
> Eno/Schmidt: Use fewer notes
>
> [The first line is the restored Klingon, the second my English gloss of
the
> Klingon, and the third line is the Eno/Schmidt "Oblique Strategies"
version.]
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 04:09:30 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: to' nech, 005: {nejlu'pu', Samlu'pu'}
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> K: nejlu'pu', Samlu'pu'.
>
> Gloss: Sought and found.
>
> Eno/Schmidt: Once the search has begun, something will be found
>
> [The first line is the restored Klingon, the second my English gloss of
the
> Klingon, and the third line is the Eno/Schmidt "Oblique Strategies"
version.]
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 04:07:16 -0600
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Sean M. Burke" <[email protected]>
> Subject: to' nech, 004: {ghorghvaD 'oH?}
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> K: ghorghvaD 'oH?
>
> Gloss: When is it for?
>
> Eno/Schmidt: When is it for?
>
> [The first line is the restored Klingon, the second my English gloss of
the
> Klingon, and the third line is the Eno/Schmidt "Oblique Strategies"
version.]
>
> --
> Sean M. Burke    http://www.spinn.net/~sburke/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 20:10:56 +0200
> To: [email protected]
> From: DOOM_er <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: could somebody check this translation for me?
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> DloraH wrote:
> >With prefixes, him, her, and it are grouped together.  But -Daj is listed
> >with only his/hers.
>
> Hm, my TKD lists -Daj as "his, her, its".
>
>  >> to boldy go where noone has gone before
> > > jaq 'ej Sovlu'be'ghach ghoS
> > > I'm also curious about {Sovlu'be'ghach}, can I use that for "the
unknown"?
> >
> >/jaq/ "be bold" is a verb.  You're using it as an adverbial.  Can't do
that.
>
> Mwuah, I meant {jaq} as "be bold", as in, "to be bold and to go to the
> unknown". But I could have better used -taHvIS indeed.
>
> >Is /Sovlu'be'ghach/ a noun refering to the action/state of not knowing or
> >does it refer to the thing that is being not known?
>
> Hm... I'm not sure? Well... Sovlu'be' is something like "it is not known",
> right? So I figured Sovlu'be'ghach would be like 'being not known'-ness...
> unknownness... hm... no, you're right, that doesn't really work here.
>
> >'ej jaq(lu')taHvIS  Daq ghoSlu'be'ta'bogh ghoSmeH
>
> Hm. {Daq ghoSlu'be'ta'bogh}, smart... Ok, thanks for the help!! I'll try
to
> remember all this...
>
> Dum`er
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 19:57:45
> To: [email protected]
> From: "Agnieszka Solska" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: could somebody check this translation for me?
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
>
> The phrase "the final frontier" is not used here to refer to a physical
> boundary but rather, it is used metaphorically, to mean something like
"the
> extreme limits of sth" (e.g. knowledge, exploration, achievement, etc).
> Perhaps that sense might be rendered by {qaD'a'}, i.e "greatest, ultimate
> challenge".
>
> logh.
> qaD'a' 'oH.
>
> >>these are the voyages of the starship Enterprise
> >>'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey 'oHvam
>
> >What I see might be a problem is that sometimes pronouns act like nouns,
> >sometimes they act like verbs.  Here it is acting like a verb and has a
> >noun suffix. Plus, the english is "THESE are the ...", which would be
> >/bIH/.
>
> Would it be clear what /bIH/ refers to?
> Maybe one of the following will work better:
>
> naDev 'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey lumuchlu'.
> (Here one presents the voyages of the starship Enterprise)
>
> DaH 'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey luDellu'.
> (Now one describes the voyages of the starship Enterprise)
>
> or
> 'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey Del muchmeyvam.
> (These presentations describe the voyages of the starship Enterprise)
>
> 'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey Del QonoSmeyvam.
> (These logs describe the voyages of the starship Enterprise)
>
> Also, the English version is extremely rich in nouns and noun phrases:
> space, the final frontier, the voyages, the continuing mission.
> I believe a good translation into Klingon would have to make more use of
> verbs.
>
> 'ISqu'
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:26:40 -0400
> To: <[email protected]>
> From: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: could somebody check this translation for me?
> Message-ID: <000401c1de8b$abdd1de0$9e4ee8cd@dlorah>
>
> > >With prefixes, him, her, and it are grouped together.  But -Daj is
listed
> > >with only his/hers.
> >
> > Hm, my TKD lists -Daj as "his, her, its".
>
> This is interesting.  p25 does list "its", but p162,165 does not.
>
> >  >> to boldy go where noone has gone before
> > > > jaq 'ej Sovlu'be'ghach ghoS
> > >
> > >/jaq/ "be bold" is a verb.  You're using it as an adverbial.  Can't do
> that.
> >
> > Mwuah, I meant {jaq} as "be bold", as in, "to be bold and to go to the
> > unknown". But I could have better used -taHvIS indeed.
>
> What's weird is that I was thinking of including "to be bold and to go to
> the unknown" as an example, and I don't know why but I didn't see it in
your
> sentence.  I need some sleep.
>
> DloraH, BG
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:31:50 -0400
> To: <[email protected]>
> From: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: could somebody check this translation for me?
> Message-ID: <000501c1de8c$648af2e0$9e4ee8cd@dlorah>
>
> > The phrase "the final frontier" is not used here to refer to a physical
> > boundary but rather, it is used metaphorically, to mean something
> > like "the
> > extreme limits of sth" (e.g. knowledge, exploration, achievement, etc).
> > Perhaps that sense might be rendered by {qaD'a'}, i.e "greatest,
ultimate
> > challenge".
> >
> > logh.
> > qaD'a' 'oH.
>
> This is true.  And qaD'a' could still refer to the physical realm as well.
> maj.
>
> > >>these are the voyages of the starship Enterprise
> > >>'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey 'oHvam
> >
> > >What I see might be a problem is that sometimes pronouns act like
nouns,
> > >sometimes they act like verbs.  Here it is acting like a verb and has a
> > >noun suffix. Plus, the english is "THESE are the ...", which would be
> > >/bIH/.
> >
> > Would it be clear what /bIH/ refers to?
> > Maybe one of the following will work better:
> >
> > naDev 'entepray' 'ejDo' lengmey lumuchlu'.
> > (Here one presents the voyages of the starship Enterprise)
>
> Your examples are certainly clear.
> The english is just as unclear as my example.
>
> DloraH, BG
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:04:16 -0500
> To: [email protected]
> From: Alan Anderson <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: could somebody check this translation for me?
> Message-Id: <a05100308b8d6986429c1@[63.232.119.73]>
>
> >> space
> >> logh
> >
> >maj
> >
> >> the final frontier
> >> veH Qav
> >
> >Hmm, this doesn't sit well in my mind, but I'm having trouble coming up
with
> >something better.
>
> For what it's worth, Skybox Card S99 (Qu') ends with this phrase:
>
>   veH Qav 'oH logh'e'
>
> -- ghunchu'wI'
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 11:16:38 -0700
> To: [email protected]
> From: Qov <[email protected]>
> Subject: yaS wa'DIch jIH
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> yaS wa'DIch vImoj.  javHu'  Duj chu' vIpuvchoH.  qaStaHvIS jav rep
> mughojmoHlI' HoD'a'. chach mIwmey, mIwmey motlh je DIqeqlI'.  cha'Hu'
> DujvamvaD jI'umchoH.   wejleS raQpo' vIHIjchoH.
>
> tlhotbogh Duj 'oH. wa'maH chorgh raQpo' HIjlaH.  cha' QuQ lo'. ngeDbe'
> puvmoHmeH Qu'.   bIQDaq Degh Hutlh. bIQDaq tlhe'meH, QuQ HoS
> vIpImmoH.  tInchoHpu'DI' Do, muD Degh vIlo'laH.  HIpwIj vIHevpu'DI',
> tlhIHvaD Duj, jIH je 'oSbogh jabbI'ID vIlI'.
>
> Duj luvo'meH, muD yuv DIngbogh naQmey.   DaH naQmey DIngmoHbogh QuQmey'e'
> vIDel 'e' vInID.  QuQ 'o'Daq 'el muD.  muD 'uytaH loS DIngbogh ghomey.
'uy
> gho wa'DIch, 'uyqa' cha'DIch, ''uyqu' wejDIch, 'uychu' loSDIch.  muDvam
> beQDaq 'el nIn.  QuQ DIchu'DI' nIn wImeQmoH.  meQtaH QuptaHvIS QuQ.
meQmo'
> nIn, muD je, Sachqu' SIpmey.  cha' HoS ghomey DIngmoH Sachbogh
> SIpmey.  'muD uybogh ghomey DIngmoH HoS gho wa'DIch.  DIngbogh naQ DIngmoH
> HoS gho cha'DIch.  QuQ Dopvo' mej SIp tuj, 'ej loQ Duj luvo' SIpmeyvetlh.
>
> SKI: twin turbine transport
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:37:02 -0500
> To: [email protected]
> From: Alan Anderson <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: yaS wa'DIch jIH
> Message-Id: <a05100307b8d64c6fb9ad@[63.232.119.73]>
>
> ja' Qov:
> >yaS wa'DIch vImoj...
>
> majQa'!  puvwI'na' SoH.  Ducha'bogh jabbI'ID vIloS.
>
> >...bIQDaq Degh Hutlh...
>
> chaq DayoymoHchugh...
>
> >...Duj luvo'meH, muD yuv DIngbogh naQmey...
>
> le' naQmeyvam.  telmey rur 'e' vIpIH.
>
> >...QuQ 'o'Daq 'el muD...
>
> nuqDaq?!  HeDlaw' QuQvam.
>
> >SKI: twin turbine transport
>
> With pontoons, yes?
>
> qaja'qa' majQa'!
>
> -- ghunchu'wI'
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 18:34:58 GMT
> To: [email protected]
> From: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: "be'be'" - double negation
> Message-Id: <[email protected]>
>
> > jatlh Christoph:
> >
> >  > you were talking about a double negation(be'be').
> >  > ...
> >  > IŽd like to know why you want to use "be'be' "?
> >
> > jatlh DloraH:
> >
> > >I find it interesting how this thread evolved.  The original question
asked
> > >if -be' could follow more than one suffix, ie:  muHoHbe'vIpbe'.  I saw
no
> > >problem with that.  But somehow this got changed and people think I
said it
> > >was ok to use -be'be'.
> >
> > jIghItlhpu' jIH.
> >
> > charghwI' suggested that there is always another way around such
sentences
> > as this one - my example, <<muHoHbe'vIpbe'>>, "he is not afraid to not
kill
> > me" (better: I am not afraid to leave you alive), could also be written
> > <<muHoHbe' 'e' chenvIpmoHbe'>> "He will not kill me. He is not afraid to
do
> > that." It's wordier, but it conforms to canon better.
>
> charghwI' feels like he's being paraphrased enough that he asked me to
speak
> for him, since this discussion involves a lot more English text than he
cares
> to wade through. charghwI' and I both feel like {-be'be'} is almost never
a
> good idea and can be recast, but we don't really see a problem with
> {muHoHbe'vIpbe'}. It is efficient and expressive and not all that
ambiguous.
> Meanwhile, I see your alternative suggestion as a curious use of the verb
> {chen}, and {-be'} is pretty clearly misplaced in {chenvIpmoHbe'}, since
I'd
> translate it as, "He is afraid to not cause that to form."
>
> If you feel a need to break this out, I'd say:
>
> muHoHbe'taH 'e' wIvvIpbe'.
>
> He is not afraid to choose that he continue to not kill me.
>
> Maybe a little neater:
>
> not muHoH 'e' wIvvIpbe'.
>
> He is not afraid to choose that he never kills me.
>
> > IMHO, even though charghwI' has strongly said that he'd rather not see
it
> > used, I, personally, don't want to see it dismissed out of hand. There
may
> > be situations in which such a construct may be useful, and maybe there's
> > some stylistic factor we don't know about yet. But I will be using it
*only*
> > if we do get confirmation - all I was doing in that message was asking
> > whether or not any canon evidence existed to that effect. Like QAO, it
just
> > isn't worth the argument if another way around exists. :)
>
> While chargwI' and I often make this argument about other contentious
points of
> grammar, I don't think we've ever applied that argument against this point
of
> grammar which neither of us considers to be controversial. This is the way
with
> threads:
>
> 1: I like lunch.
>
> 2: I consider pretzels to be lunch.
>
> 1: I don't like pretzels.
>
> 3: So, why does 1 dislike lunch?
>
> 1: I didn't say I didn't like lunch. I said I DID like lunch.
>
> 2: Did you hear that 1 is calling 3 a liar?
>
> 4: So, why does 3 not like lunch?
>
> 5: I hear that 1 and 3 are forming a new society based upon the banning of
> lunch.
>
> 6. Did you hear that 2 ate 1's lunch? Well, I understand he at least ate
all
> the pretzels...
>
> > BTW, I have also had a sentence containing <<not>> and the suffix
<<-be'>>
> > vetoed; hence, the double negative <<-be'be'>>, one after the other,
> > probably isn't a good idea.
>
> THAT is usually just a mistake. Likely, that's what I wrote about earlier.
In
> some languages (and English slang dialects) the "double negative" in "I
ain't
> never goin' there again," is an emphatic, rather than a logical reversal
of one
> negative by the other. It has the opposite meaning of "I will never not go
> there again." So far as we know, Klingon always adhere's to the logical
string
> of negatives reversing each other rather than emphasizing each other.
That's
> really the nugget in the middle of this confused thread.
>
> > Qapla' 'ej Satlho'
> >
> > ro'Han
>
> Will
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 13:50:49 -0700 (MST)
> To: [email protected]
> From: [email protected] (Kyle Rytting)
> Subject: Re: Sep
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
>
> im new to TlhIngan Hol so is there any web site with more words that are
> ot from the klingon dictionary?
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:06:34 -0700 (MST)
> To: [email protected]
> From: [email protected] (Kyle Rytting)
> Subject: RE: Sep
> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
>
> i was just fooling around to see how the kli.org thing worked thanks
> though!
> how long have you speeked klingon?
>
> http://community.webtv.net/frogturd/KylesStarTrek
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:41:14 -0400
> To: <[email protected]>
> From: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: Sep
> Message-ID: <000601c1de8d$b4bb18c0$9e4ee8cd@dlorah>
>
> > im new to TlhIngan Hol so is there any web site with more words that are
> > ot from the klingon dictionary?
>
> For a complete vocabulary list you need:
> TKD (The Klingon Dictionary), don't forget the addendum in the back.
> KGT (Klingon for the Galactic Traveler)
> NWL (the New Words List) from the KLI website.  This has the words that we
> received from Okrand via sources other than TKD and KGT.
> (NWL can be found at: /tlh/newwords.html
>
> DloraH, BG
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:46:34 -0400
> To: <[email protected]>
> From: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> Subject: (was: RE: Sep)
> Message-ID: <000701c1de8e$738fa2c0$9e4ee8cd@dlorah>
>
> > how long have you speeked klingon?
>
> I first opened the dictionary in '92; but I didn't get serious about
> learning until '96.
>
> DloraH
> http://www2.rpa.net/~cheesbro
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 22:29:55 -0400
> To: <[email protected]>
> From: "DloraH" <[email protected]>
> Subject: RE: (was: RE: Sep)
> Message-ID: <000101c1dea5$45204f40$404ce8cd@dlorah>
>
> > > how long have you speeked klingon?
> >
> > I first opened the dictionary in '92; but I didn't get serious about
> > learning until '96.
>
> ('96 is when I got internet service and found the KLI.  Until then I
thought
> I was the only one.)
>
> DloraH
> http://www2.rpa.net/~cheesbro
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of tlhIngan-Hol Digest
> ***********************************

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