tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Sat Aug 01 14:41:51 1998
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Re: Exercises?
- From: Robyn Stewart <[email protected]>
- Subject: Re: Exercises?
- Date: Sat, 1 Aug 1998 14:40:23 -0700 (PDT)
[email protected] wrote:
>
> > Translate into Klingon:
> >
> > The brigadier is hungry.
> ghung 'ech
> > The night is dark.
> Hurgh ram
maj.
> > She exhausted him.
> ghaH tlhuchta' ghaH
You've written a correct sentence, but not the translation of what I
asked for. I asked for just "exhausted," simple past tense, not "had
exausted," perfective. Do not mistake perfective for past tense. Do
not use perfective unless you mean perfective meant.
> As thlIngan Hol does not differentiate between he/she, this could be
> any combination of "He/She exhausted him/her." (??)
Right. It adds extra challenge to the writing of Klingon porn. :)
> > I wait for you(singular).
> qaloS
> > We will defeat you(plural).
> recheHtaH
The verb defeat is /jey/. /cheH/ means defect, as in betray your
faction and go over to the other side. The continuou aspect is not
impossible here, just not what I expected. I would translate
/rejeytaH/ sentence more like "we will go on defeating you." The
continuous aspect /-taH/ refers to an ongoing event with no
discernable terminating goal or progress towards an end.
> > I am disgraced.
> jIwebpu'.
In English this is a perfective concept, referring to the completion
of whatever put you in the state of disgrace, but in Klingon the
perfective notion of the English is included in the verb /web/, It
means "be disgraced." Think of it as meaning "be in a state of
disgrace."
jIweb - I am disgraced. (Also "I was disgraced" and "I will be
disgraced.")
> > They torture you and the lieutenant.
> SoH Sogh je nIjoy'
You and the liutenant are two people, that's plural you. /lIjoy'/
> > A woman is reading a journal.
> QonoS laD be'
I was looking for aspect here, the idea that she was in the process of
performing the action. You could have said /QonoS laDlI' be'/ (she's
reading it through) or /QonoS laDtaH be'/ (she's reading it, but not
like she's going to finish it, just reading). English doesn't give
that information without context, so either would be a perfect
translation.
> > Two men will be reading a label.
> per lulaDtaH wa' loD
Two men. /cha'/. Numbers practice. Hmm. The only places you've used
continuous aspect so far is in translating English future tense.
Aspect and tense are unrelated. Kllingon does not have tense. Deal.
continuous aspect, shown in past/present/future
jIpuvtaH - I was flying, I am flying, I will be flying.
perfective aspect in past/future/present
vIHoHpu' - I had killed him, I will have killed him, I have killed him
> > I am the man of the eggs.
> QIm loD jIH
maj.
> > The pipyus was Paul.
> Paul 'oH pIpyuS'e'pu'
1. The English is simple past tense. The perfective was not asked for.
2. If any verb suffixes were used in this sentence, they would go on
the pronoun as to be, not the noun.
Reread section 6.3 and we'll do some PTB practice.
> > Drop your(singular) weapons!
> nuHmey tIchagh SoH
> Used the pronoun, as /tI-/ is used for both you (sing.) and you
(plural).
It comes off like "You, drop the weapons." Allowable, but not what I
asked for. The way to show whose weapons they are is the possessive
suffix. /nuHmeylIj tIchagh!/
> > Yesterday, my troubles were apparently remote.
> wa'Hu' Hoplaw'pu' jIH Sengmey
Aha. You seem to have skipped section 3.3.4 on possessive suffixes.
Read it.
/wa'Hu' Hoplaw' SengmeywIj/ - Yesterday my troubles were apparently
remote.
> A guess, wasn't sure how to translate the concept that something had
> happened at a specific time...
You just say the time, that's all. Once you have said /wa'Hu'/, the
time of the sentence is specifically and unambiguously in the past.
If you add the perfective, you are claiming that the action of the
sentence was completed *before* yesterday. And that's not what I
asked you to write.
> > The animal's nose is very long.
> tIqqu' Ha'DIbaH ghIch
maj. You know the noun noun.
> > We can go to the sea.
> bIQ'a'Daq wIjaHlaH
The noun in -Daq is not the object of the verb. /majaHlaH/
> Couldn't find a word for sea, so used /bIQ'a'/ (ocean)
Is there a difference between sea and ocean? I use them
interchangeably.
> > I saw the star swallow the planet.
> yuQ ghuppu' Hov 'e' vIlegh
Nope. I'm asking you to say you saw the star swallow the planet. You
didn't see that it had swallowed it. You saw the actual action. If
any aspect suffix is appropriate here it might be /-lI'/. Definitelly
not perfective.
> > We need to sit at the edge of the sea.
> bIQ'a' HeH wIba'nIS
> Same as above
You've said "we need to sit it." You need the locative on the place
we need to sit, and hence the no object prefix.
bIQ'a' HeHDaq maba'nIS.
> > I am sad because the water is dirty.
> lammo' bIQ jI'IQ
maj.
> > The man who cannot see touched the large animal.
> Ha'DIbaH tIn Hot leghbe' loD
I guess you don't know /-bogh/ yet. Read section 6.2.3.
...Hot leghlaHbe'bogh loD.
> > He says the animal resembles a rope.
> tlhegh rur HaDIbaH 'e' jatlh ghaH
Reported speech: tlhegh rur Ha'DIbaH jatlh
See the end of section 6.3 and the FAQ for more details on reported
speech.
> > A sharp mind is better than a sharp sword.
> yab jej law' 'etlh jej puS
And finally, re-read section 6.6. to see how to form the comparative.
This says merely "The mind is sharper than the sword." Grammatical,
but not the same message.
Lots to cover here. Klingon tense: Klingon DOES NOT HAVE verb affixes
that indicate tense. The time alone indicates that. If no time is
given, no time is known. Like in an English sentence if a person
doesn't say whether or not something is proceeding towards a goal, you
don't know. Klingon perfective can be added to a verb to indicate
specifically that the action was complete or ongoing at the time of
the sentence. Not as of now when you are telling the sentence. As of
the time stamped on the sentence. Have a look at the FAQ.
Here are some other posts on perfective. Not necesarily the best,
just some I could find.
some examples and a discussion of its relation to Dutch
/cgi-bin/mfs/1998/Apr98/0410.html
Me getting a little silly
/cgi-bin/mfs/1998/Jan98/0024.html
ghunchu'wI' on translation
/cgi-bin/mfs/1998/Jan98/0092.html
Me on translating English tense into Klingon.
/cgi-bin/mfs/1998/Feb98/0583.html
Translate the sentences below into Klingon. Preserve aspect.
Yesterday two corporals killed three defectors.
Five prisoners will bury their corpses.
Two days from now I will have achieved my goal.
A year ago I was deep frying some battered fat. (frying in progress)
I had already prepared gakh stew.
Suddenly, my friend arrived.
His targ had bitten him.
He was bleeding on my floor.
I tied four bandages on his arm.
He and I ate the food.
Next year we will tie the targ to the stairs.
Maybe I will kill the targ and prepare it.
Heart of targ is always tasty!
Qapla'. :)
==
Qov - Beginners' Grammarian
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