tlhIngan-Hol Archive: Mon Aug 29 21:17:55 1994
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Re: KLBC: maghwI'pu'
According to R.B Franklin:
>
> > > neH maghwI'mey chaH maghwI'pu''e' QaQ.
> >
> > ...I suspect you want to place {neH} at the
> > very end of the sentence...
>
> pabpaqwIj vIlaDqa' 'ej DaH jIyajchu'.
> Duy'ba' vIghItlhpu'bogh mu'tlheghvetlh.
bIyajmo' jIQuch.
> QamchoH yoDtargh 'ej pe'vIl jatlh, "jagh DajeymeH nIteb yISuvrup!"
>
> mu'tlheghvetlh vIghItlhqa' vInID:
Ummm. You forgot the pronoun {'e'}. You don't need it with the
verb {neH} or verbs of speech, but you do need it with {nID}.
> maghwI'pu' qab chaH maghwI'pu' QaQ'e' neH.
"The only good traitors are bad traitors."?
> Also, from reading p. 50, it appears that {-'e'} should be attached to the
> adjective instead of the noun.
Good point. I missed that. But I *did* know it.
> On another subject: Can only intransitive verbs be used as adjectives?
> My instincts tell me that if I want a transitive verb to modify a noun, I
> need to use {-bogh}.
Good instincts.
> Still another question:
> I was listening to the PK tape and I came across what sounded like:
> SoHDaq qeylIS qa' yInjaj. (May the spirit of Kahless live within you.)
> This construction appeared odd to me because it indicates {yIn} is a
> transitive verb and {qeylIS qa'} is the object. Am I reading this right?
This one has an interesting history. When Okrand tried to
illustrate the use of {-jaj} on Conversational Klingon, he
apparently screwed up the word order. He placed the subject in
front of the verb instead of after. Krankor caught the error
and wrote an article about it in HolQeD. Okrand apparently
read the article. Hence the comment on Power Klingon about the
unfortunate Terran who reversed the word order in a toast and
now they are still finding his scattered parts across the
galaxy.
So Okrand made up new rules for toasts. According to Krankor's
analysis, these old toasts use the word order
Object-Subject-Verb instead of the usual Object-Verb-Subject.
Keep in mind that this is not a global rule for all uses of
verbs with the {-jaj} suffix. It is a specific rule for
traditional (i.e. written only by Okrand) toasts.
What this means to you is that when YOU are writing anything
original, forget that this exception exists, unless you are
trying to invent some ancient, traditional toast (like the
Quaker Oats: "Nothing is better for thee than me,"). Meanwhile,
if you see something that looks this kind of strange and the
verb uses {-jaj}, then it may use OSV word order. Know the
exception in order to READ a toast, but you don't need to use
it in order to WRITE anything at all.
> yoDtargh
charghwI'